Anyone have scoop or thoughts on what's going to happen in the Vale, including but not limited to Baelish?
Me too. Reading through I was always intrigued by some of these things that are only mentioned and never really talked about in detail. I'm especially interested in the Doom of Valaryia I hope so. Now that I know about thisI am quite excited about it.
i dont have any input but im curious and interested in the vale. i actually started liking sansa chapters i doubt it works out as perfectly as baelish thinks it will, always interested in littlefinger though.
Jon Snows eyes aren't purple,violet,lavender, or lilac(Viserys LOL) either. doesnt change the fact after the the Tower of Joy Chapter in Book 1, that I am utterly convinced that he is a Rhaegar-Lyanna Love Concoction. No other mere "hostage" that was found in her "bed of blood" would be guarded by 3 Kingsguard even after Rhaegar got got unless the child was the love spawn of the Heir to the throne. I am very intrigued with this as well although I think its pretty easy to see where GRRM is going to go with this. Littlefinger has been pretty smarmy about how he has easily outsmarted the Tully/Stark Hoarde(Ned,Lysa,Catelyn). I have a feeling his ego is going to get so big that he thinks very little of Sansa' "game" and she will get one over on him that will lead to his demise. I really wonder how the Mia Stone(obviously is Robert Baratheons bastard in the Vale)/Sansa situation is going to work out.
Thought this exchange was interesting, notably the part where Aemon chuckles after Jon calls Ned his father and then goes into his family's story. (around 2mins) Was this exchange like this in the book? I cant quite remember...
doesn't Aemon later tell Sam that Rhaegar and him had talked about prophesies and how they first believed believed Rhaegar was The Prince that was Promised, then later believed it was Aegon. it's when he hears about Dany and the dragons and says they were wrong all along and the Valyrian word for "son" is gender neutral and it was really daughter. or maybe I just made all that up.
The convo took place. Aemon said that he wished he was younger so he could help Dany. I don't think Aemon would know the truth about Jon if R + L = J. Rhaegar was fighting a war and probably didn't have time to say Lyanna was pregnant (if he even knew).
jus tto revive this on my second read through.Im through book 3 so far Sam has the Horn of Joramen BenJen is not cold hands like some believe otherwise he would have been able to go through the Brothers Gate. Only a true brother of the nights watch can open the gate. Only way it could be BenJen is if he became the great other and nowis barred from going past the wall due to the spells on the wall Who does everyone think is the Drowned Hero from the sea in Melisandre's prophecy? I got to believe it is Davos although I have an inkling suspicion it is PatchFace, Princess Shireen's Fool.
i do think benjen is coldhands, but i think we warged into a wight before he died. that explains why he couldn't pass through the brothers gate.
Oh and The "False" Aegon is a true Aegon but not the Prince that was Promised. There are two Aegons. Aegon by Elia aka the "False Aegon" and Aegon aka. Jon Snow by Lyanna, the Prince that was Promised. Rhaegar just was not great at naming kids so he double upped. Jon Snow is also not Ned's shame but his evidence of it. Ned did have a fling with Ashara Dayne, and they had a love child by the name of Ned Dayne. When Ashara Dayne flung herself from the balcony to her death, her brother took in Ned Dayne as his own so he is in fact not Ashara's nephew but her son with Eddard Stark. Ashara's brother took in Ned as one of his own to keep the secret so Ned could take Jon Snow back to Winterfell to protect the heir to the Iron Throne.Arthur Dayne,the Sword of the Morning, last chivalrous duty to the House Targaryen. An earlier parallel to the Baby swap that took place with Mance Rayders Boy and Gilly's child in the last few books.
Very intriguing theory. I could also see the Children of the Forest/Others have recognized his importance to lure Bran and have used him as a ploy. Another idea I have played around with that BenJen hasnt been seen or heard from because he is on Skagos and that is how Rickon will come back in play.Rereading the small excerpts that Rickon has had through the story, have shed enough light that he has a very important part to play in the last few books and I dont believe Osha alone can guide him alone.
i don't buy benjen at skagos at all. why would he desert the night's watch? and how could he go from a ranging beyond the wall, survive an attack by the others, and then make it past the wall and sail to skagos. that makes zero sense.
no one said he deserted the Watch and maybe he went to Skagos to escape the others and investigate the claims of Cannibalism of the Wildlings. He could have very easily reached Skagos without having to go South of the Wall.
well then why would a sworn brother stay there for so long? and why would he survive an attack from the others and not warn his brothers? his duty is with the watch at the wall, not at skagos. it makes zero sense for him to be there.
How about the wall coming down? It has to at some point... a buddy of mine thinks it will happen at the beginning of the next book, he pointed out at how cold it was getting during the last Jon scene (Others gathering on the other side?) - I don't see this happening, as I think Sam has the horn, but thought that it was an interesting theory that would speed things up
The wall coming down is definitely possible and seems to e pretty likely, IMO. There's no way GRRM creates all this build up about the Others and then they don't get to wreck shit on Westeros. It might happen at the very end of the next book, but I really think it will be the main focus of the last book.
I love the reread of the series. Robert and Neds dialogue about the Lyanna/Rhaegar situation on the re-read is so awkward its funny. I kept expecting Kanye West to come out of nowhere and be like.... Yo Robert. I know you want Lyanna, but Rhaegar already be tapping that ass. Her pussy game is ridiculous Ned Stark reaction: " i know you wanted to tap that ass bro, but Rhaegar and Lyanna were bumping uglies willingly
Curious what you guys thought about this passage from the Lady of High Heart: "I dreamt a wolf howling in the rain, but no one heard his grief," the dwarf woman was saying. "I dreamt such a clangor I thought my head might burst, drums and horns and pipes and screams, but the saddest sound was the little bells. I dreamt of a maid at a feast with purple serpents in her hair, venom dripping from their fangs. And later I dreamt that maid again, slaying a savage giant in a castle built of snow." She turned her head sharply and smiled through the gloom, right at Arya. "You cannot hide from me, child. Come closer, now." "I see you, I see you, wolf child. Blood child. I thought it was the lord who smelled of death...You are cruel to come to my hill, cruel. I gorged on grief at Summerhall, I need none of yours. Begone from here, dark heart. Begone!" Spoiler "I dreamt a wolf howling in the rain, but no one heard his grief," [Everyone pretty much agrees this is grey wind crying over Rob] the dwarf woman was saying. "I dreamt such a clangor I thought my head might burst, drums and horns and pipes and screams, but the saddest sound was the little bells. [I assume this is the music playing during the Red Wedding, played by the assassins in disguise, but what are the "little bells?"] I dreamt of a maid at a feast with purple serpents in her hair, venom dripping from their fangs. [Has to be Sansa at Joffrey's wedding] And later I dreamt that maid again, slaying a savage giant in a castle built of snow." [This is the one I'm most curious about. Who does Sansa slay? At the Eyrie? Littlefinger? Or maybe at Winterfell? Or does this refer to something that has already happened?] She turned her head sharply and smiled through the gloom, right at Arya. "You cannot hide from me, child. Come closer, now." "I see you, I see you, wolf child. Blood child. I thought it was the lord who smelled of death...You are cruel to come to my hill, cruel. I gorged on grief at Summerhall, I need none of yours. Begone from here, dark heart. Begone!" [Does Arya smell like death for becoming a faceless man? For her family dying at Red Wedding? Because she says the names every night? Or maybe all of them?]
I haven't seen this anywhere and maybe i'm way off. Spoiler Is Robert Arryn Littlefinger's son? We know he and Lysa had a relationship. Based on what we know about Jon Arryn, Robert doesn't carry any of his qualities. Robert could also be like Sam though, a complete deviation of his father.
"I dreamt of a maid at a feast with purple serpents in her hair, venom dripping from their fangs." I know she isn't a maid, but this sounds like Lady Ollena, the Queen of Thorns. Wasn't she the one that poisoned Joffrey with some shit in her hair?
She put the poisoned stone into the jewelry in Sansa's hair. Not sure who actually put it in Joffrey's cup.
ohh okay. i read through sos way too quick and forgot a lot of the details. I knew Lady Ollena was responsible for the death, I just forgot exactly how.
So, I've started a re-read of the series. I just finished the first book. I was reading mostly for info regarding the future books or things not yet revealed. 1. R + L = J. As many have said, I think it's fairly obvious that Jon is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna. The most obvious sign is the Kingsguard at the Tower of Joy and the bed of blood Ned describes. The "promise me Ned" is also a dead give away. It had to be more important than just burying her in Winterfell. He mentions the heavy price he had to pay to keep her promise as well. 2. Could Tyrion be a Targaryen? When Jon first describes him, he say his hair is almost white. Could Aerys have had an affair with Lady Lannister? Tyrion mentions could Tywin was never sure if he was a true born son. This could be denial because he's a dwarf, but it's an interesting comment. 3. One part that struck me was when Jon was talking with Benjen and Jon was saying how he wanted to do great deed at a young age. Benjen replied that Daeran Targaryen did great deeds and was dead at 18. Interesting foreshadowing there. 4. Just an interesting fact: Rhaegar knighted Gregor Clegane. Must not have known him that well. 5. Varys still has an interesting part to play. He's obviously Team Aegon after reading the 5th book, but he seems to be supporting Dany in the secret dialogue with Illyrio. Maybe he wanted Viserys to invade with the "savages" and have Aegon look like a hero in response. 6. I have a feeling the Blackfish will end up opposing Littlefinger in his chess match in the upcoming books.
I've always believed the R+L stuff but was never quite sold on them being love interests. However, the Creators of the show have been told things about the endings and they make it pretty clear that Dany's lover will be found at the wall. A more obvious approach to the whole blue rose in a wall of ice vision for the tv audience i guess. Also from the show, I guess a dragon will burn Kings landing. Will it be one of Dany's and will it be under her direction or just some random rampage or will it not be one of hers at all and be some other dragon? I guess this will probably happen in the next book since it seems pretty early winter.
I'm becoming more and more convinced that Jon and Dany will end up winning the Game of Thrones and ruling together as king and queen. I'm not sure whether or not Tyrion helps them, but I'm starting to lean that way as well.
I agree. I fully believe Jon and Dany are the two main characters (The song of ice (Jon) and fire (Dany)), and will end up either together on the Iron Throne, or die defeating the Others.
It all clicked for me when I read an interview with GRRM. He talked about how his family used to be wealthy but they lost their money, and he spent most of his life growing up in public housing. We see that theme play out with most of the characters, but it's most evident with the Stark children, everything they've ever known taken from them by the Lannisters/Littlefinger and the Boltons, and Dany, forced to grow up in a strange land after the family she never knew was removed from power. Coupled with the fact that no two characters better represent Ice and Fire, plus the overwhelming evidence for R+L=J, and there you have it.
It really would be a great ending. Three of everyone's favorite characters ruling together in King's Landing with the dragons there to protect them. It just sounds way too good to be true.
yeah, it's going to end with Jon dead, Dany a pleasure slave, and the dragons as Lilfinga's pets up at the Eyrie
after reading this thread i need to re-read the books, and take notes like i did a la harry potter...
I loved Harry Potter but these books need to be read with a whole other level of attention to detail. This series is so much better than HP and it ain't even close. Simply epic.
i agree that they require more attention to detail, but not better than HP. they are different so i couldn't rank one better than the other. i mean i read each book in harry potter at least 10 times, and with this book, while i love it, i could never do that.