Not cheeky but I find the idea that the criminal with a pen is intrinsically worse than the one with a gun doesn't hold up great.
My current understanding of the overall argument: Russia and NATO both have the goal of empire building at the cost of the other. Russia has only been able to be successful through force, while the West has been able to do it through the coercive tactics that Lyrtch mentions. Post Cold War, was NATO supposed to ignore the former Soviet affiliated countries that were absorbed into the USSR through occupation post WW2? Is the line drawn at Ukraine and countries with deep historical ties to Russia? I'm honestly ignorant, and would like some explanation of this argument.
i think thats the question being answered since 2013 or whenever this ramped up but yea nuclear foes encroaching on a neighbor of another foe isnt well-received. And hasn't in the past. Spoiler but youre sorta asking multiple questions that need multiple answers, and a lot of its complex. Most direct path is what is or should be NATOs purpose, if any.
Oh my fucking god damn bro, we should… holds back uproarious laughter, go back to… crying literal tears… the gold standard. Appreciate you underlining and bolding the dumbest parts though. “what goes up, must come down” damn, that’s deep dude.
now both countries who would be involved fighting against each other are making fun of our war machine it's really impressive how deep the propaganda reaches. smart people who could tell you the whole playbook of afghanistan/iraq, but no bros it's for real serious with Putin this time, he even set a date!
good thing congress was able to overwhelmingly vote for sending another weapons package that will likely end up in the hands of reactionary militias in Ukraine before Putin announced he was jk
I mean, they are "moving things back" while also deploying folks closer to the border. So maybe slow that roll.
is your theory that NATO has been trying to bait Russia into attacking Ukraine by releasing intelligence to discredit Russia’s pretext for invading Ukraine and taking other measures to increase the cost to Russia of invading Ukraine?
I don't think it's possible to craft a hypothetical where Russia would benefit from an invasion and I'm confident that's very apparent to everyone involved except American media and its consumers I think nato's goals are generally the same as they have been. Destabilize, arm the groups who will further destabilize - we're arming literal Nazis as I'm guessing you're aware of, work with these friendly reactionary group(s) that win the power struggle, only allow them to do business with the corporations outlined in the IMF loan that they have no option but to take. Ukrainians take a massive L, America further pushes the right wing nationalism that we will get fucked by in the next couple decades
what do you assess are the strategic differences that would make a present day invasion of Ukraine a no win situation in Putin’s mind unlike the 2014 invasion of Crimea or the 2008 invasion of Georgia?
sure guys Putin had no plans of doing anything, he just moved 150,000 troops, half a navy, and half of air force into place just for "training" at a cost of how many rubles? One hell of a long game by him
2014 was in the aftermath a nato backed coup securing a vital position for themselves as any reasonable person would expect. Support from Crimeans both pre and post referendum show majority support for being a part of Russia, always over 70% from what I've seen, no such support exists within Ukraine as whole. Ukraine would obviously receive robust support unlike a ethnically russian territory less than 1/20th its size
So Putin managed to strengthen NATO at a time when support was dwindling, push Ukraine further toward the west, increase NATO troop presence in Europe and increase military aid to Ukraine but he's laughing and actually got what he wanted?
Hopefully the pullback is legit. Best case outcome imo as NATO gets to say they got Putin to back down while Putin gets to say he got the west to give concessions. Both sides can sell that they got what they wanted back at home while no one has to die. That said, nothing has really changed as far as I am concerned. Will need to see more concrete moves as well as US intel confirm of mass pullback before I feel good. For me that happens when/if the Russian troops leave Belarus.
Yeah I'm not sure I'm buying the Russia moved most of their military units to surround Ukraine for something they never planned on doing.
our current puppet is telling us to chill the fuck out and very publicly making fun of our war machine. The last neutral guy was thrown out in a literal NATO backed coup because he wasn't licking the boot enough. We armed actual literal Nazis and gave rise to the conditions for a civil war afgahnistan. iraq. bascially all of south and central america, vietnam etc etc etc it's Putin that's the big bad meanie this time guys I swear! just listen to the same talking heads who sold you on those conflicts
That’s because you’re an ignorant pleb, the Western Neo-Nazi imperialists obviously double-dog dared him and you can’t really just walk away from that.
The “no guys seriously America is the real bad guy here” schtick is getting old. Yeah we get it, the USA has done, is doing, and will do a lot of fucked up things. Our country is fucked for a lot of different reasons. That doesn’t mean that Russia isn’t an objectively terrible country run by an objectively terrible guy. This thread is turning into a circle jerk of people who listened to two seasons of Blowback and think they’re foreign policy experts. It’s exhausting
stop reading the thread then both sides of this potential conflict are publicly making fun of our war machine, that's worth thinking about
They're kicking off a new trial against Navalny today to keep him in jail for another 15 years interestingly enough
guaranteed some OAN personality or fox pundit is using that term now. These guys always just mimic what they hear on the radio and tv word for word
This is something worth calling out as well- this military build up is distracting (both at home in Russia and internationally) from this trial. I don't think it is the sole reason for the build up but could certainly be a contributing factor.
i found this to be a pretty good look at the situation What You Should Really Know About Ukraine - FAIR
How arrogant and childish. Have you noticed that the vast majority of people that have posted in this thread for years and certainly the last few months have disappeared in the last 2 days while the same crew of 6-10 posters who show up everywhere to drag any foreign policy political adjacent topic down the same shit hole took over and told the rest of us we were all idiots, pawns, boot lickers, and war mongerers. “Just don’t read the thread”. Go fuck yourself dude. Forget the politics and foreign policy, this is about being an arrogant prick. It’s you sticking your nose in everybody’s fucking business when nobody asked. Ironic, given your position on what’s happening in Ukraine. Ass hole. I am not sure Putin is done here. Would be a huge back off from an incredibly high ledge.
If this was all part of our war machine, why did we empty our embassy in Kyiv, and tell all our citizens to leave Ukraine and now Belarus? That doesn’t seem to lineup with this new narrative to me