Detroit Pistons thread: With the exchange rate that’s a win streak

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by DeToxRox, May 19, 2015.

  1. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    I think most of the draft people are going to have Holmgren ranked #1 based on what I've seen. Having Chet second is probably going to put Vecenie lower on him than most.

    I think we would pick Chet #1 overall if we got it, although Cade did an interview months ago where he basically said Banchero was the best guy in the class and I'm curious if that kind of thing factors in at all if Cade decided to lobby for that behind the scenes.
     
  2. The Subspace Mariner

    The Subspace Mariner Well-Known Member

    I feel like Banchero can come in and give you 20 and 10 as a rookie with good shooting splits. I feel like he's been slept on and brushed aside for whatever reason, but the guy can shoot, handle it well for a 6'10" big, and he's a plus, plus athlete, which people tend to forget because his game isn't "flashy".
     
    FourClover01 likes this.
  3. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    I don't think people are sleeping on that stuff. Every report I read is that, of the top 3 bigs, he's the one most capable of being a #1 option offensively. The problem is Chet has all-time level numbers as a shot blocker, and Smith is considered potentially a Mobley/Herb Jones type defender. Banchero is pretty rough defensively right now, which is why people have him at 3 below them.

    I don't know enough about him athletically to really speculate much on how much of that can improve and how much is just stuff you have to live with to get his offense.
     
  4. Tug

    Tug Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Detroit LionsDetroit PistonsMichigan State Spartans

    I’ve read too much about Smith being 6’10 and having a picture perfect shot and now I think he’s KD without the Twitter shit posting so I want him
     
    smeegsgreen and MG2 like this.
  5. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    I'll be thrilled with any pick in the top 3, and wouldn't mind if we got the 3rd pick and just got to take whoever was left without having to deal with picking between them. They're all really good (even Chet). Just a matter of what kind of team you want to build around Cade.

    I'm currently ranking them Smith/Banchero/Chet, but I get the idea of Chet being first even if it scares the hell out of me currently.
     
    Tug likes this.
  6. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    From ESPN on who the Rockets, Magic and Pistons should take if they get the #1 pick (it was Holmgren for all of them) or if they fall to 4...

    Detroit Pistons
    [​IMG]
    No. 1 pick odds: 14% | Top-three odds: 40%

    Player the Pistons should select with the No. 1 pick: Chet Holmgren

    Holmgren is the ideal prospect to unlock the best parts of Cade Cunningham while addressing some of the Pistons' most pressing issues. Until they added Marvin Bagley III, Detroit sorely lacked a lob catcher for Cunningham, as they shot just 60.6% at the rim last season, 28th in the league. Holmgren shot 80% at the rim last season, far and away the best mark in the NCAA among players to take at least 100 shots at the rim. He's the best vertical spacer of the potential top-3 picks.

    The Pistons also ranked 30th in the NBA in non-corner 3 accuracy at 32.1%, and 28th in frequency on above the break 3s. Smith addresses this need immediately, but he doesn't offer the lob-catching AND rim protection as Holmgren, who shot 39% from beyond the arc as a freshman.

    Adding a pick-and-pop threat like Holmgren will give Cunningham the necessary space to use his size, strength and skill level to score more efficiently inside the arc than he did as a rookie. Offensively, Holmgren also perfectly complements both Isaiah Stewart and Bagley III, while giving Saddiq Bey more space for mid-post isolations, where he's really effective.

    Smith is a strong fit on both ends given his stellar defense and ability to function as more of a piece early on in his career. While adding a 6-10, 250-pound offensive talent like Banchero would make the Pistons incredibly dynamic, he isn't quite as natural of a fit alongside Cunningham. Banchero is still improving his ability to play off the catch, with much of his success coming from self-created shots.

    On top of all that, the Pistons are sorely missing a true rim protector, and don't have any real shot blockers. Holmgren wouldn't have to worry about checking the NBA's bruisers like Joel Embiid if he's playing alongside a physical big like Stewart.`

    So while Smith is an excellent fit alongside Cunningham and Bey, and adding an offensive talent like Banchero would take pressure off Cunningham and make the Pistons even more exciting, Holmgren plugs the most holes and can function as a complement to Detroit's star point guard.

    - Schmitz

    Player the Pistons should select if they fall out of the top three: Jaden Ivey

    No player projected outside the top 3 complements Cunningham quite like Ivey. His open-court speed, sudden burst and tremendous leaping ability meshes perfectly with Cunningham's more methodical pace. Think James Harden and Russell Westbrook in Oklahoma City from 2009 to 2012. Pistons general manager Troy Weaver has long been credited for pushing for Westbrook leading up to the 2008 draft, and I'd have to imagine he sees some similarities -- at least physically and athletically -- between the former UCLA guard and Ivey.

    Cunningham rocks defenders to sleep and beats them with skill and deception like Harden, while Ivey can offer the type of peak-Westbrook speed in transition that's so dangerous in the regular season. Although an incredibly efficient offense, Purdue ranked 237th in pace according to Kenpom.com, and Ivey's ability to change ends in the blink of an eye figures to come to life even more in the wide-open NBA game.

    Ivey has also greatly improved as a perimeter shooter, and he's proven capable of adding value in multi-guard lineups like he did at Purdue. With Cunningham as the primary ball handler and on-court leader, Ivey can stick to his strengths early in his career while not being thrust into a lead guard or leadership role, which are both areas he still has considerable room to improve. Simply put, Ivey would give the Pistons an injection of excitement on a team that isn't exactly loaded with high-flyers other than Hamidou Diallo. A young core of Cunningham, Bey and Ivey immediately makes the Pistons a League Pass favorite.

    - Schmitz
     
  7. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    Edwards did a bunch of tankathon mocks today. Only somewhat interesting things (other than I think he's wrong on who a lot of teams would take) are...

    - He now thinks we'd take Ivey over Murray at 4
    - He thinks we'd take Mathurin over Sharpe
    - He seems to think Holmgren/Smith are the clear top 2 for us, with a gap between them and Banchero.
     
    Randy Bobandy likes this.
  8. Tug

    Tug Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Detroit LionsDetroit PistonsMichigan State Spartans

    I think I agree with all of this given what we’ve seen from Weaver. He seems to prioritize ‘athleticism’ so Ivey > Murray (I think this is wrong)
     
  9. spartanchuck

    spartanchuck Well-Known Member

    At No. 4, I’ve got the Pistons taking Purdue guard Jaden Ivey. If presented this scenario a few weeks ago, I would have taken Murray without hesitation. And while I still believe there’s a 50 percent chance Murray would be the pick over Ivey, I get the sense that not everyone in Detroit is sold on the Iowa product. To some, even though Ivey may possess a lower floor than Murray, the upside the explosive Boilermaker guard carries outweighs that. Ivey addresses the need for athleticism on Detroit’s roster, and he was a pretty good spot-up shooter in college. Ivey’s lack of playmaking for others is concerning, particularly for a roster that doesn’t have many natural playmakers, but maybe a little coaching can get him to show improvements in that facet of his game.
     
    Tug likes this.
  10. Tug

    Tug Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Detroit LionsDetroit PistonsMichigan State Spartans

    I believe all of this and disagree. But I think Murray is going to be a highly effective pro
     
    spartanchuck likes this.
  11. Randy Bobandy

    Randy Bobandy Fan of: Michigan, Pistons
    Donor

    Going to die on the Ivey hill. I think he's an A level NBA athlete who looked bad at times because he played shitty BigTen style basketball in college.
     
    buckwild and FourClover01 like this.
  12. Tug

    Tug Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Detroit LionsDetroit PistonsMichigan State Spartans

    His mother played for the Detroit Shock, so it’s a cool story, too. But not my preference
     
  13. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    I think it depends on what kind of team you want to build around Cade. If you want someone who can shoot and play a role that gives Cade space to be a version of Luka, I think you take Murray (assuming there's a Grant trade to be made). If you want to give Cade a second guy who can create for himself and score on his own so he doesn't have to be Luka, you take Ivey. I've started to come around to the idea that Ivey might be the better long term play if you're trying to build a team that can win a title one day, which is why I'd be really tempted to take Banchero over Smith and Chet if we're in the top 2.

    I still kind of wonder if Sharpe is the in between pick that could split that difference, but that's a huge risk and I'm not sure how Weaver is going to view that kind of thing with Cade already in place.
     
    Randy Bobandy and Tug like this.
  14. Randy Bobandy

    Randy Bobandy Fan of: Michigan, Pistons
    Donor

    Barring something unforeseen, Cade should be the primary offensive initiator as long as he's here. I don't know if I want him at Luka level of being virtually the entire source of creating offense, though. At least not when we're ready to compete.

    I think Murray will be a good player off the jump and probably better than Ivey early on. Ivey would also be a riskier pick, but I have a hard time seeing him not becoming awesome in the NBA. Cade being able to shift the defense and kick to Ivey to drive open lanes or get open looks from three gets me going. Maybe my hatred for big man BigTen basketball may have me over-projecting how he translates.

    I'm curious why you think Banchero is a better long term play over Smith and Chet. I'm a little lower on Banchero than most, I think.
     
  15. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    Banchero is the best scorer of the bigs and a better passer/shot creator than any of the guards in the lottery. He has a Blake starter kit, IMO. I love Smith, too, and Banchero's defense is scary. I'm fine with any of those top three. But Banchero's skill set is the hardest to replicate.
     
  16. Randy Bobandy

    Randy Bobandy Fan of: Michigan, Pistons
    Donor

    Gotcha. I havent seen much of Jabari or Chet, but I was under the impression they were higher ceiling types than Banchero.
     
  17. Vinegar Strokes

    Vinegar Strokes Fire Izzo
    Donor
    Michigan State SpartansDetroit PistonsDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsDetroit Tigers

    I think both of them have higher ceilings than Panchero.
     
  18. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    Chet has the highest ceiling in the draft. I don't think that's really debatable.

    Smith has the higher floor than the other two. I don't think his ceiling is, but I guess that's dependent on how someone defines that. I really like Smith, but right now he can't really dribble, create a shot for himself or anyone else. If he improved drastically in all those areas, he could be a bigger Kawhi, which would make him a top 3-5 player in the league. But how likely is it that someone improves that much in those areas compared to someone like Banchero, whose issues are more common (needs to improve defensive intensity/awareness and be a more consistent shooter).among rookies?
     
    Randy Bobandy likes this.
  19. DeToxRox

    DeToxRox Uncle T
    Staff Donor TMB OG
    Detroit PistonsDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsWolverhampton WanderersDetroit Tigers

    Feels like the Suns are going to have to make some big changes after this debacle. Let Ayton walk.
     
    Tug likes this.
  20. ~ taylor ~

    ~ taylor ~ Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG

    What an embarrassment.
     
  21. RalfBully

    RalfBully #21
    Staff Donor TMB OG
    Michigan State SpartansDetroit PistonsDetroit LionsTiger WoodsDetroit TigersSneakers

    tough to watch that and want to give him max tho
     
    Lip and DetroitNole like this.
  22. DetroitNole

    DetroitNole Well-Known Member
    Donor

    Since Portland didn't get the extra lottery pick, assuming they still have interest in Grant, thoughts on doing a S+T with them centered around Anfernee Simmons (assuming his medical checks out). Not sure Portland would even do that
     
  23. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    Would be shocked if Portland entertained that. I think it's more likely they'd trade their pick (if it's not top 4) than give up Simons.
     
    The Subspace Mariner likes this.
  24. buckwild

    buckwild #BucketsGetsBuckets
    Donor
    Ohio State BuckeyesDetroit LionsDetroit PistonsDetroit Red Wings

    Hoping for the #2 pick tonight...let someone else roll the dice on Chet
     
    Tug likes this.
  25. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    Anywhere in the top 3 - ecstatic

    Either 4 or 5 - still happy

    6 - not thrilled, but whatever

    7 - very, very disappointed
     
  26. Constant

    Constant Meh
    Donor
    Detroit PistonsMichigan WolverinesDetroit Red WingsDetroit Lions

    Based on this, 7 seems inevitable.
     
  27. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    Surprised Hamilton was willing to come off the bench after Wallace got to do it last year. Hope he doesn't boycott the event.

     
    Anison, buckwild, ~ taylor ~ and 2 others like this.
  28. DeToxRox

    DeToxRox Uncle T
    Staff Donor TMB OG
    Detroit PistonsDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsWolverhampton WanderersDetroit Tigers

    7th now for sure
     
    MG2 likes this.
  29. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
    Donor

    Honestly, Hamilton being the face of us getting the 7th pick will make me feel better about it because at least I'll still be able to hate him.
     
    Lip, ~ taylor ~ and DeToxRox like this.
  30. Constant

    Constant Meh
    Donor
    Detroit PistonsMichigan WolverinesDetroit Red WingsDetroit Lions

    Can't wait to see if he's still wearing the face shield.
     
    Lip and fetumpsh like this.
  31. ~ taylor ~

    ~ taylor ~ Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG

    I'm not sure why the Pistons brass think Pistons fans really like Rip Hamilton.
     
  32. buckwild

    buckwild #BucketsGetsBuckets
    Donor
    Ohio State BuckeyesDetroit LionsDetroit PistonsDetroit Red Wings

    I like this guy as a Pistons twitter follow, but what gross placement for this champagne bottle for a picture on the internet....

     
  33. ~ taylor ~

    ~ taylor ~ Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG

    [​IMG]
     
  34. Constant

    Constant Meh
    Donor
    Detroit PistonsMichigan WolverinesDetroit Red WingsDetroit Lions

    Ken M gave me my best laugh of the day.
     
    DetroitIrish3, ~ taylor ~ and Lip like this.
  35. Randy Bobandy

    Randy Bobandy Fan of: Michigan, Pistons
    Donor

    Rip Hamilton beat the fucking Lakers in the finals. Who the fuck cares that he boycotted john fucking qster?!
     
    Gustavo Fring, spartanchuck and Tug like this.
  36. Vinegar Strokes

    Vinegar Strokes Fire Izzo
    Donor
    Michigan State SpartansDetroit PistonsDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsDetroit Tigers

    Lottery was held a couple hours ago. We did not make the top. 4. Probably 5th or 6th.
     
    DeToxRox likes this.
  37. DetroitIrish3

    DetroitIrish3 Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsDetroit Pistons

    Where did you get that from?
     
  38. Lip

    Lip Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Michigan State SpartansDetroit LionsGeorge Washington Colonials

    shut up
     
    Tug, DeToxRox and DetroitNole like this.
  39. Lip

    Lip Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Michigan State SpartansDetroit LionsGeorge Washington Colonials

    his new bit is to make shit up
     
  40. DetroitNole

    DetroitNole Well-Known Member
    Donor

    Posted opposite info in Wings thread last week and then came back and said he made it up and fooled people. Get ready for the "got you" post
     
  41. DetroitNole

    DetroitNole Well-Known Member
    Donor

  42. smeegsgreen

    smeegsgreen Big fan of Koalas
    Michigan State Spartans

  43. DeToxRox

    DeToxRox Uncle T
    Staff Donor TMB OG
    Detroit PistonsDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsWolverhampton WanderersDetroit Tigers

    Only an idiot would fall for that, right ~ taylor ~
     
    Lip, ~ taylor ~ and Tug like this.
  44. DeToxRox

    DeToxRox Uncle T
    Staff Donor TMB OG
    Detroit PistonsDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsWolverhampton WanderersDetroit Tigers

    buckwild likes this.
  45. Vinegar Strokes

    Vinegar Strokes Fire Izzo
    Donor
    Michigan State SpartansDetroit PistonsDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsDetroit Tigers

    Unfortunately I trust my sources on this one.
     
  46. DeToxRox

    DeToxRox Uncle T
    Staff Donor TMB OG
    Detroit PistonsDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsWolverhampton WanderersDetroit Tigers

    Shit did Johnny Kane tell you that while you guys were painting your faces for the Tigers game tonight?
     
  47. DetroitIrish3

    DetroitIrish3 Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishDetroit LionsDetroit Red WingsDetroit Pistons

    Listen, if I need my hopes dashed I need it to happen while watching TV and not in here haha
     
    Vinegar Strokes likes this.
  48. DetroitNole

    DetroitNole Well-Known Member
    Donor

    My sources disagree, who doesn't trust Pistons thoughts

     
  49. smeegsgreen

    smeegsgreen Big fan of Koalas
    Michigan State Spartans

    I heard the same thing