Official Ukraine Thread: Putin On The Fritz

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by AU3kGT, Jun 21, 2015.

  1. timo

    timo g'day, mate
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    So, no talking about Russian war crimes. Got it.

    Can we get a list of countries / entities currently in conflict we're allowed to criticize for human rights violations? Artoo

    Is Myanmar off limits? Ethiopia? Syria? Israel? Boko Haram?

    What about past conflicts? Can we criticize the Khmer Rouge? Leopold II? Indonesia? The Ottomans? the Nazis? After all, the United States was doing some horrible things during those same periods. Glass houses and such, right?
     
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  2. Voodoo

    Voodoo Fan of: Notre Dame
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    By that same logic it’s not even fair to criticize the United States since other countries did worse
     
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  3. Handcuffed

    Handcuffed A Succulent Chinese Meal
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  4. Sir Phobos

    Sir Phobos Knight of Mars, Beater of Ass.
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    most of Europe has a history that makes America's war crimes look like baby-town frolics.
     
  5. The Milkman

    The Milkman Send lawyers, guns and money, shit has hit the fan
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    That’s some really interesting logic
     
  6. SmoochieWallace

    SmoochieWallace Ipse dixit
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    Counterpoint: it isn’t.
     
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  7. WhiskeyDelta

    WhiskeyDelta Well-Known Member
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    I mean guys, Achilles dragged Hector’s corpse around the walls of Troy, which is a war crime, so I don’t really think we can criticize anyone’s prosecution of a war.
     
  8. Tigers

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  9. WhiskeyDelta

    WhiskeyDelta Well-Known Member
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    Can we not have a European, Iranian, and Chinese conflict at the same time? At some point they'd call in reserves and I like my civilian job. And also, ya know, untold human suffering is bad.
     
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  10. Tigers

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    I know we assume a healthy dose of propaganda in these numbers but gahdang. Russia hit 100k around the new year and now over 150k. Most of that 50k so far this year is in bahkmut

     
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  11. WhiskeyDelta

    WhiskeyDelta Well-Known Member
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    I find the aircraft number highly suspect.
     
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  12. theregionsitter

    theregionsitter Well-Known Member
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    I find everything on that list suspect
     
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  13. theregionsitter

    theregionsitter Well-Known Member
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    the Chinese economy is really rotten and the demographics of the country are awful to apocalyptic

    I’d imagine they will start a war to distract the population at some point
     
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  14. Jake Barnes

    Jake Barnes Team Mac OG
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    China’s biggest problem in a potential large-scale conflict will be a lack of reliable allies.

    For all the US’s issues in geopolitics, they have spent the last 80 years developing ironclad defense bonds with a number of economic powers in both the European and Asian theaters that can help with logistics and bases of operations that China just doesn’t have the diplomatic ties to match. Xi and the party have to understand that.
     
  15. HowdyHorns

    HowdyHorns Well-Known Member
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    China’s biggest issues besides demographics are the fact they are the largest importer of food and petroleum products. Without a true blue water navy to protect these imports the country would be in trouble on the most basic fronts extremely early in any conflict.
     
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  16. Jake Barnes

    Jake Barnes Team Mac OG
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    So like a modern version of WWII Japan
     
  17. HowdyHorns

    HowdyHorns Well-Known Member
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    Japan had a capable navy to start WWII.
     
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  18. Bruce Wayne

    Bruce Wayne Billionaire Playboy
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    The Republican Party has entered the chat
     
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  19. WhiskeyDelta

    WhiskeyDelta Well-Known Member
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    They don’t need to attack really, though. They have to functionally take over or deny access to Taiwan and the ocean maybe 1000 miles off their coast for long enough and costly enough in Korean/Japanese/American men and material for politicians in those countries to feel the bite of their electorate not liking the cost of defending an island they can’t find on a map.
     
  20. timo

    timo g'day, mate
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    Probably a much greater chance of the Chinese / Russians doubling down on election interference and getting Trump or a Trump tier corrupt moron back in the executive branch than an actual "hot" war.

    The US (and most of its strongest allies) is well on its way to destroying itself; a costly war that risks eliminating all multicellular life on the planet isn't necessary. China can afford to play the long game.
     
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  21. Tigers

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    Personal opinion alert

    I don't necessarily disagree on China not wanting a war and being able to play the long game. BUT there are a few things at play in China which are somewhat wildcards in this equation.

    China can likely play to play the long game (compared to the US) and historically has done that. The question is can Xi afford to play the long game? Internal pressure and dissent is growing on a few fronts. Being able to blame someone else (see Xi comments this morning blaming US for issues) and conflicts can help him. Xi is very feared inside china and needs to keep an unquestionable hold on power.

    China also has several population issues that are getting worse and worse:
    -Aging population - the single child policy really screwed up their age demographics. You think the US is facing an issue as Boomer retire? China is fuuuuucked. They have a fully inverted pyramid age spread- they don't have young people to replace old people in the work force. Additionally it is the responsibility of the child to take care of their parents. So you get married and you have one couple taking care of 4 old people then extrapolate that to 2 generations. Combine this fact with the realities of a war. China has an army of only children. Each death destroys the future of an entire family. Today's china is not the same one that would happily send human wave after human wave into the grinder of the korean war.
    -Human Worker Population - They have been grabbing people from rural china for years and bringing them into the cities to work to fill the factories for years. They are running out of people to bring in. Wages are rising as are working expectations- it will soo be cheaper to outsource to Mexico and other places than China. Fucked.
    -Somewhat related to both- They recently announced they undercounted their population by at least 300m (aka the US population). They have to import so much food and energy to keep this population moving. Fucked.

    idk, just seems like there is a lot of stuff at play in china which is not often talked about- they certainly have more than their fair share of unique internal pressures which have not historically been there.
     
  22. theregionsitter

    theregionsitter Well-Known Member
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  23. timo

    timo g'day, mate
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    Maybe, but I don't understand how a potential hot war with the United States would help their population dynamics.

    As far as outsourcing labor, yeah, they're already doing that and they're going to need to do that a lot more in the coming years. Probably why they're buying up massive tracts of land all over Africa, Europe, and the Americas. Arable land, minerals / mining, cheap sources of labor. My partner works in public health and travels to Africa quite a bit (or at least used to; she has to take care of her mom these days)... and it's incredible how much of the continent they're buying up. Like, the hinterlands of rural Senegal, 7 hours drive from Dakar, there'll be all this land that the Chinese government now owns.

    Don't get me wrong: there's a very real chance of a war with China over Taiwan, the Philippines, the Korean peninsula, Japan, etc. It would almost certainly be disastrous for all involved though and hopefully both the Chinese government and US government are smart enough to recognize the danger.
     
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  24. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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  25. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    i got yelled at for thinking this was the most obvious conclusion
     
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  26. timo

    timo g'day, mate
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  27. HuskerInMiami

    HuskerInMiami Well-Known Member
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    What is the law that they passed?
     
  28. HuskerInMiami

    HuskerInMiami Well-Known Member
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  29. timo

    timo g'day, mate
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    I'm by no means an expert on Georgian politics, but best description I can find is here:
    https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/03/07/georgia-foreign-agents-bill-tramples-rights
    ***HRW is by no means impartial.

    Nearly identical law was passed in Russia. Basically targets foreign based NGOs, public health groups, foreign media, etc. Lots of those groups receive money from USAID, which, I suspect, is the chief target here.

    From my understanding, Georgia Dream (the political party in power) is centre-left economically (as far as that goes in that region of Europe), but is funded and run by a billionaire oligarch, and is quite conservative on social issues.
     
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  30. timo

    timo g'day, mate
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    Isn't it just a guidance system on a regular "dumb" bomb?

    How are they going to deliver them without a usable air force?
     
  31. timo

    timo g'day, mate
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    insert british food joke.

    also, snow coffee
     
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  32. RockHardJawn39

    RockHardJawn39 #FranklinOUT
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    Would’ve been funnier if Artoo tried to post this as credible.
     
  33. EagleDuck

    EagleDuck Well-Known Member
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    Wait until they hear about Pigeon Tuesday.
     
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  34. GrizzliesDrew

    GrizzliesDrew Fuck Freeze
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    My favorite NK propaganda video is showing tornado/hurricane damages to a home and implying that's the condition of all American homes.
     
  35. Artoo

    Artoo 1312
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    Yeah.

    Western propaganda had you guys believing that there is no more prisoners in Russia, they are all on the fronlines. And that there was no equipment and cold weather gear for any soldiers, so they all froze to death this winter.
     
  36. joe-

    joe- yesterday is a hard word for me
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    totally that’s why the war is over
     
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  37. theregionsitter

    theregionsitter Well-Known Member
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    Thread

    :doge:

    At the rate this is going in 6 months not sure what both sides will be fighting with
     
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  38. timo

    timo g'day, mate
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    Isn't Russia making more? (*edit: from thread, I guess they aren't making more of that flavor of MBT)

    Artoo how many tanks per month y'all popping out these days?
     
  39. Artoo

    Artoo 1312
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    More than Ukraine, less than UK, US, Germany are gifting Ukraine.
     
  40. Duck Smoker

    Duck Smoker Cheekbones like geometry and eyes like sin.
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    Wow, now this forum is too snooty to enjoy squab? I'm not really a fan either, but it's better than Whataburger.
     
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  41. dathalfnukkahd

    dathalfnukkahd dat nukka high definition
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    Lol

    No one believed there are not anymore prisoners in Russia and they all got used and killed in the war. Who ever said that?

    No one believed that ALL Russian soldiers don't have proper equipment or cold weather gear. There a lot of them that don't though. You can go on the internet and find hundreds of videos of Russians crying about they have no food, water, gear or equipment.

    Where do you come up with these stupid ass comments?
     
  42. Artoo

    Artoo 1312
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    It's pretty easy, when you idiots get so fucking worked up over them
     
  43. dathalfnukkahd

    dathalfnukkahd dat nukka high definition
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    Show me where anyone said anything of the sort.

    You can't, you just made it up.
     
  44. Artoo

    Artoo 1312
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    It's absolutely hyperbole, you fucking simpleton. Congratulations on figuring that one out
     
  45. timo

    timo g'day, mate
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  46. Tarpon Nole

    Tarpon Nole Well-Known Member
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    Don’t worry everyone. The dumbest person on this site, possibly the dumbest I’ve come across on the internet, is posting in ways us dullards cannot comprehend.

    artoo is actually a genius. I’d put his big brain right up there with ole Elon’s
     
  47. Sir Phobos

    Sir Phobos Knight of Mars, Beater of Ass.
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    dance, puppets, dance!
     
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