Season 5 - The night is dark and full of Spoilers [book readers thread]

That's what I said right after that episode

 

Dany says "Does it hurt?" and he's also licking the bloody wounds on his wing. Sure he's probably tired, but he's obviously hurt/ in pain.

Also, he took them back to his perch where he chills/eats/sleeps. Most or all of the bones/skeletons are old and have been there a while.

 

little of column A, little of column B

 

I don't think he's going to have to fight the whole Khalasar. Most likely they bend they turn to Dany afree Drogon shows up and they see him protecting her. The Dothraki are very superstitious.

Even if it takes killing Jhaqo, the Khalasar will bend the knee if you will.

 

Also Dany isn't injured but has the pale mare and might be burned a little

 

Because Dany perfectly understands everything that is going on with Drogon...

I have no doubt that he's got some wounds, I just think he wanted to eat and rest at that precise time because there was no danger AT THAT MOMENT.

With dropping the ring it does appear the show might be taking things in a different direction (shocker) because Drogon shows up in the books

 

So who do we think rides the dragons? The obvious choices are Dany, Tyrion, Jon.

Less obvious, and perhaps even more interesting options are: Brown Ben Plumm, Euron, Victarion, Jamie, Bran (warg)

Which dragons do you think are ridden by whom? Obviously Dany / Drogon is a safe bet, but isn't Rhaegal in the books turning really feral? I'd think if an 'evil' character like Euron is going to ride a dragon, then it would be Rhaegal.

Viserion is white, right? Jon Snow seems to make sense there, as Ghost is white, etc.

 

I think it's just a cliffhanger. He'll show up IMO.

 

Well, Tyrion is there now and has access to them. There's probably going to be a scene next season where he visits the dragon pit and they may hint at it. Or he gets Quentyn'd. I don't know how the dragons work though now. Will the other 2 just follow Dany on Drogon without their own riders? So if and when they go to Westeros other's may get a shot at bonding with one? No clue how that works. It seems like the rider has to have some sort of contact with them, hence someone who is around them to dragon whisper them so I'm guessing it would have to be someone who has access to them.

 

Maybe Dany dropped the ring because she didn't want the Dothraki to see her wearing it?

 

There's some cursory evidence that you need to have old Valyrian blood to ride them. This is based on how they respond to various characters who are supposedly descended from Targaryens or other old Valyrian families (Brown Ben Plumm).

 

I took it as her leaving a clue on where she was

 

Benioff and Weiss are nothing if not planners. Say what you will about their narrative choices this season, but in my opinion the best skill they have is meticulously planning the inclusion and exclusion of characters, simplifying storylines, and dropping breadcrumbs from the very beginning. They're adapting a huge body of work into only a few seasons of TV. Despite the fact they're each over 10 hours long, there are so many storylines that they can't afford to have too many dalliances and diversions. All of the minutia has to contribute to later events.

I've tried not to get overly invested in Jon but think he's guaranteed to be back. It seems classic GRRM to just leave him completely dead. However, this latest season really, truly seems like a spoiler for the next book if anything. Too much of GoT's synthesis of the books tips you off. Pretty obvious that GRRM, in one of their long-term narrative talks, tipped them off with certain things they must include in order for the resurrection/rebirth/continuation of Jon to happen. The show has such limited time, yet we did the whole Thoros & Beric bit, put Melisandre in the same environment, show her interest in Jon this whole season...it all adds up as a pretty clear signal of where GRRM is going himself.

Spoiler

All I can think of is that Thoros and Beric are there simply for LSH but if there ever was a time to do that bit, it was this episode. I think showing so much of Thoros & Beric suggest at minimum, one of the two resurrections has to happen. I doubt both do - it's one or the other.

 

how does Tyrion ride a dragon if he can't even ride a full-sized horse? (something they made sure to mention last night)

 

status of Drogon and Dany dropping the ring were mentioned in last nights Inside the Episode.

 

he rides Hodor while Hodor rides the dragon DUH

 

He engineered a saddle thingy for Bran.

 

Yeah no way Jon is for real dead- we're just going to casually mention who his parents might actually be a few times, leave it unresolved then kill him not long after Sam says he always comes back.

Also, I know us book readers get upset over some changes- but they really have to dumb it down for show watchers. I was talking to a coworker about it just now, and she had no clue who Rhaegar was, it took her a minute to realize who the Targs even were (I had to explain- Dany's family back at home).... They're making a show, for show watchers and have to keep it simple sometimes. The only time they care about book readers is when they fuck with us with a Benjen mention. assholes.

 

As much as it seemed to fuck with us, it was also the vehicle they used for the Jon murking so they had to remind show watchers who he was or else it would have made even less sense for Jon to jump up excitedly to go see that cheesy traitor sign

 

yeah your coworker sounds the same as my girlfriend. She hasn't read a page and watches the show very casually. Invested in the show's main characters themselves and doesn't know a single thing about referenced/past characters or places. It's been kind of interesting to see her perspective.

Can't imagine the show without Jorah and Barristan because of how much goddamned exposition they're given. Their sole jobs seemed to be explaining critical backstory you'd only get if you've read

 

My worry is how the show writing will fare now that they have no material to pull from. Grrm is a literary genius. Everything intertwines and stuff is set in motion from multiple books before.

The reason dorne was boring is that it's made up. Stannis death was cheap and hurried? Same thing. Hasn't happened yet. Mel just leaves for no reason? Well they got to get her back to the wall to raise Jon somehow.

Tyrion is done well. But he's such a good actor it's hard for him to suck.

Oh well. Twow better be published by the next season.

 

Almost sounds like Brienne strikes the tree instead of Stannis as they cut away...at least that's what I want to believe

 

Tree dead

 

My tinfoil hat theory.
Drogon- Dany and Jon Snow
Rhaegal- Euron
Viserion- Jamie

I believe Dany will die sometime after they get to Westeros. All of the 3 dragons roam the country. Jon gets Drogon, Euron gets Rhaegal and Jamie(who I believe is a Targ just like Cersei, with Tyrion being the only legitimate Lannister child) gets Viserion.

Bran will take control of the Ice Dragon which the white walkers will control once the wall comes down.

 

We're really talking about fucking Euron riding a dragon?

 

This may have been mentioned I only scanned the thread but why would they kill Jon after they let him through the gates. That makes zero sense unless mel is going to bring him back.

They should have just not opened the gate and not let the wildlings and traitor Jon through.

Also, what's happening with Davos, maybe the leader of the Nights Watch?

 

He's not in the Night's Watch so he can't even be considered for their leader.

 

he could take the black it's not out of the question.

 

I wonder how eager he'd be to do that after he finds out they killed JonJon

 

Yeah they butchered the reason for killing Jon. They couldve easily done a pink letter finally breaking the last bit of hold he had on the black brothers. It couldve been worse, but definetly wouldnt have been that hard to make it make sense strategically.

 

He's not about to be sticking around now that they just mutinied Jon. Hell, he's a Stannis supporter who supports Jon. They may try and kill him as well.

 

In the books, Tyrion probably knows as much about dragons as anyone. It's the main reason I've always wanted him to be with Dany. Once he realizes he's got the dragon blood, he's in there.

Euron is gonna bring a dragon to jon, the end.

 

Yea it made no sense. The only thing I can think of is that they'll still plan to honor the agreement with the wildlings but if I'm Tormond I don't trust them at all since they killed Jon because of his dealings with the wildlings

 

the Night's Watch has now murdered their last two Commanders and the only other person that seemed to care about what was happening north of the Wall is assumed dead outside of Winterfell. if Jon isn't brought back or Dany gets to Westeros real fast, I don't see how the Wall is any more than a speed bump for the White Walkers. the North is a disaster right now.

 

Also, Dorne continues to make no sense.
- every scene with the Sand Snakes looks corny and uncomfortable like a HS play
- its one thing for Elaria to be respected as Oberyn's girl but she has no political power and there is no reason for Doran to keep her around or have any tolerance for her nonsense. Even less sense to bring her to send off the ship. Why bring people that tried to kill Myrcella? What's the point?
- It stands to reason that the ship will turn right around but Elaria seemed to be in no hurry to get away

 

The wildlings and Jon loyalists raise hell and take control of the wall. Imprison the traitor brothers for execution, Jon walks out of his funeral pyre and saves Ollie.

 

I dont expect a Jon resurrection until his lineage is made public, or until Mel is informed. She really has no idea who Jon is, but if she's told he's Rhaegar's heir, well then she might start putting pieces together. I dont see her resurrecting him under any other instances. The fire only gives her glimpses and slight inclinations from what I gathered, and it takes more than some glimpses to put it all together.

I would have a full nerd boner if Howland Reed comes to the wall to pay his respect to Jon, and he tells them who he was.

 

We can all admit Dorne was a royal fuckup. I'm sure they will too, in time.

 

Has there ever been any indication from the Fat One that Howland Reed will play a role?

 

She clearly knows his lineage somehow. Why else try to seduce him?

This is assuming she, indeed, only fucks for religious reasons we've seen in the past, and not, say, she just simply wanted some of Jon's longclaw.

 

aren't they going to burn the body?

 

Mel knows a lot, especially in the books. She even tried to fuck him in the show. She knows he's packing that King dick.

 

The Pink Letter has been thought to be false all this time...

Bastard,

Your false king is dead, bastard. He and all his host were smashed in seven days of battle. I have his magic sword. Tell his red whore.

Your false king's friends are dead. Their heads upon the walls of Winterfell. Come see them, bastard. Your false king lied, and so did you. You told the world you burned the King-Beyond-the-Wall. Instead you sent him to Winterfell to steal my bride from me.

I will have my bride back. If you want Mance Rayder back, come and get him. I have him in a cage for all the north to see, proof of your lies. The cage is cold, but I have made him a warm cloak from the skins of the six whores who came with him to Winterfell.

I want my bride back. I want the false king's queen. I want his daughter and his red witch. I want this wildling princess. I want his little prince, the wildling babe. And I want my Reek. Send them to me, bastard, and I will not trouble you or your black crows. Keep them from me, and I will cut out your bastard's heart and eat it.

Ramsay Bolton, Trueborn Lord of Winterfell


After seeing episode 10, what part do we think is false now? Seems like it might be accurate...

 

I haven't read, that but that would be a fair assumption.

Spoiler

WHAT IF HE DOESNT BURN!!!!!!!!111!!!!!

 

Where is Manderly? Has he been in the show any? Is that where Bienne takes Stannis and Sansa?

 

I've forgotten but doesn't that AA prophecy say something about him being reborn through flame or something