2012 Breeders Cup

Discussion in 'Gambling Board' started by mtsucalico85, Oct 24, 2012.

  1. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    The Breeders Cup is next Friday and Saturday at Santa Anita. Pre-entries were released today, so I'd figure I'd start up a topic for any discussion on handicapping the races.

    The Breeders Cup website released the Equibase PP's, which I have linked below. Post positions will be drawn sometime early next week. Some horses are pre-entered into two races and will make a decision on which race to enter before the draw.

    I'll make my picks after the draw sometime next week, but I'll give some thoughts before then. Obviously the $5 million Classic is the most prestigious race run this weekend, and the Juvenile is a chance to look at potential Kentucky Derby horses for next year, but the race I'm most excited to see this year is the Mile. It was a bigger deal in the media last year due to Goldikova, but I like the 2012 version better- arguably the best American horse (Wise Dan) and the best European horse making the trip over (Excelebration) are running in this race. The Ladies' Classic also will be a hell of a race- particularly if Royal Delta goes in this race as expected as opposed to running against the males in the Classic.

    Friday:
    Juvenile Sprint
    Marathon
    Juvenile Fillies Turf
    Juvenile Fillies
    Filly and Mare Turf
    Ladies' Classic

    Saturday:
    Juvenile Turf
    Filly and Mare Sprint
    Dirt Mile
    Turf Sprint
    Juvenile
    Turf
    Sprint
    Mile
    Classic
     
  2. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    From an early glance through the PP's, I picked out a longshot that intrigues me in each race. I defined 'longshot' as a horse that was 6-1 or higher according to preliminary odds made by DRF (those are also the odds I have listed next to each horse). Doesn't mean I'll pick them on top, but I wouldn't throw them out of consideration. You can get a lot of good prices on horses that you wouldn't expect on Breeders Cup day.

    Juvenile Sprint: Super Ninety Nine (8-1)
    Marathon: Fame and Glory (20-1)
    Juvenile Fillies Turf: Flashy Ways (10-1)
    Juvenile Fillies: Spring in the Air (6-1)
    Filly and Mare Turf: Up (15-1)
    Ladies’ Classic: My Miss Aurelia (6-1)

    Juvenile Turf: Dry Summer (15-1)
    Filly and Mare Sprint: Contested (8-1)
    Dirt Mile: Fed Biz (6-1)
    Turf Sprint: Corporate Jungle (10-1)
    Juvenile: Fortify (12-1)
    Turf: Shareta (6-1)
    Sprint: Emcee (6-1)
    Mile: Moonlight Cloud (6-1)
    Classic: Mucho Macho Man (10-1)

    Couple things I will point out- for longer turf races, I almost always lean toward the European horses. Outside of turf sprinters, there is a clear advantage in turf horses overseas, as the most important races in North America are on dirt, while they are on turf in the UK and France.

    Second, for all of the juvenile races, Lasix, a drug to limit bleeding inside horses, has been banned. Lasix is banned in Europe, but legal in North America. Since the majority of North American 2 year olds have run on Lasix this year, it adds another question mark in handicapping those races. That's actually one of the reasons I would give Fortify a look, because he is the only horse running in the Juvenile that already runs without Lasix, and those races have him competitive with the rest of the field.

    One other thing I will mention is that, in the past, horses coming from the East Coast (specifically New York) have struggled at Breeders Cups that have been held at Santa Anita. This includes times where the main track at Santa Anita was synthetic, but also times where it was dirt. Just something to keep in mind. For that reason, I would give a bump in consideration to horses that have ran quality races at Santa Anita in the past.
     
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  3. TLAU

    TLAU Dog Crew
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    normally get some really good writeups from avid horse betters on another site. i only bet on the triple crown. will post if/when I see the writeups just in case they are helpful. normally most of it goes over my head because i know shit about tracks/horses/etc
     
  4. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    Post positions were drawn today. Once I look at the PP's, I'll give my thoughts for each race.

    Friday

    Juvenile Sprint
    1) Hightail (8-1)
    2) Ceiling Kitty (12-1)
    3) Merit Man (8-5)
    4) South Floyd (6-1)
    5) Super Ninety Nine (5-1)
    6) Hazardous (8-1)
    7) Sweet Shirley May (4-1)
    Marathon
    1) Atigun (9-2)
    2) Fame And Glory (5-1)
    3) Balladry (30-1)
    4) Grassy (30-1)
    5) Jaycito (6-1)
    6) Calidoscopio (8-1)
    7) Not Abroad (5-1)
    8) Romp (30-1)
    9) Alumdena (30-1)
    10) Eldaafer (8-1)
    11) Commander (15-1)
    12) Worth Repeating (5-1)
    13) Sense of Purpose (15-1)
    14) Juniper Pass (30-1)
    Juvenile Fillies Turf
    1) Kitten’s Point (12-1)
    2) Summer of Fun (30-1)
    3) Sky Lantern (3-1)
    4) Flotilla (8-1)
    5) Spring Venture (5-1)
    6) Watsdachances (4-1)
    7) Oscar Party (20-1)
    8) Tara From the Cape (12-1)
    9) Nancy O (30-1)
    10) Waterway Run (10-1)
    11) Moonwalk (20-1)
    12) The Gold Cheongsam (20-1)
    13) Flashy Ways (10-1)
    14) Sustained (12-1)
    15) (AE) Infanta Branca (15-1)
    16) (AE) Moulin de Mougin (15-1)
    Juvenile Fillies
    1) Beholder (5-2)
    2) Executiveprivilege (2-1)
    3) Spring In The Air (15-1)
    4) Renee’s Queen (30-1)
    5) Dreaming of Julia (5-2)
    6) Almost an Angel (30-1)
    7) Broken Spell (20-1)
    8) Kauai Katie (3-1)
    Filly and Mare Turf
    1) Star Billing (30-1)
    2) Zagora (8-1)
    3) Stormy Lucy (30-1)
    4) The Fugue (7-2)
    5) Nereid (15-1)
    6) Lady of Shamrock (12-1)
    7) Up (12-1)
    8) Nahrain (6-1)
    9) Marketing Mix (9-2)
    10) Ridasiyna (4-1)
    11) I’m A Dreamer (8-1)
    12) In Lingerie (12-1)
    Ladies' Classic
    1) Grace Hall (10-1)
    2) My Miss Aurelia (4-1)
    3) Class Included (30-1)
    4) Questing (4-1)
    5) Awesome Feather (3-1)
    6) Royal Delta (9-5)
    7) Include Me Out (15-1)
    8) Love and Pride (8-1)
    Saturday

    Juvenile Turf
    1) Summit Country (30-1)
    2) Artigiano (8-1)
    3) George Vancouver (8-1)
    4) Gervinho (15-1)
    5) Fantastic Moon (12-1)
    6) Dundonnell (4-1)
    7) Brown Almighty (20-1)
    8) Balance the Books (8-1)
    9) Noble Tune (6-1)
    10) Joha (6-1)
    11) Dry Summer (10-1)
    12) I’m Boundtoscore (20-1)
    13) Know More (8-1)
    14) Lines of Battle (12-1)
    15) (AE) Riding Legend (20-1)
    Filly and Mare Sprint
    1) Teddy’s Promise (20-1)
    2) Belle of the Hall (20-1)
    3) Dust and Diamonds (9-2)
    4) Strike the Moon (30-1)
    5) Rumor (20-1)
    6) Turbulent Descent (5-1)
    7) Great Hot (30-1)
    8) Musical Romance (4-1)
    9) Groupie Doll (Even)
    10) Switch (12-1)
    Dirt Mile
    1) Rail Trip (10-1)
    2) Delegation (12-1)
    3) Jersey Town (4-1)
    4) John Scott (12-1)
    5) Fed Biz (6-1)
    6) Shackleford (2-1)
    7) Emcee (5-2)
    8) Tapizar (12-1)
    9) Second City (30-1)
    Turf Sprint
    1) California Flag (6-1)
    2) Camp Victory (10-1)
    3) Great Mills (20-1)
    4) Tale of a Champion (30-1)
    5) Next Question (10-1)
    6) Upgrade (30-1)
    7) Reneesgotzip (8-1)
    8) Great Attack (10-1)
    9) Bridgetown (9-2)
    10) Corporate Jungle (6-1)
    11) Mizdirection (20-1)
    12) Chosen Miracle (15-1)
    13) Unbridled’s Note (5-1)
    14) Starspangledbanner (10-1)
    15) (AE) Global Power (30-1)
    16) (AE) Starspangled Heat (30-1)
    Juvenile
    1) Title Contender (6-1)
    2) Speak Logistics (8-1)
    3) He’s Had Enough (20-1)
    4) Shanghai Bobby (2-1)
    5) Monument (12-1)
    6) Dynamic Sky (12-1)
    7) Capo Bastone (15-1)
    8) Fortify (9-2)
    9) Power Broker (5-2)
    Turf
    1) Point of Entry (3-1)
    2) Turbo Compressor (15-1)
    3) St. Nicholas Abbey (7-2)
    4) Treasure Beach (12-1)
    5) Shareta (7-2)
    6) Cogito (30-1)
    7) Little Mike (12-1)
    8) Kindergarden Kid (30-1)
    9) Dullahan (12-1)
    10) Optimizer (20-1)
    11) Slim Shadey (10-1)
    12) Trailblazer (6-1)
    Sprint
    1) Sum of the Parts (20-1)
    2) Jimmy Creed (6-1)
    3) Gantry (10-1)
    4) Coil (5-1)
    5) Justin Phillip (20-1)
    6) Fast Bullet (12-1)
    7) The Lumber Guy (6-1)
    8) Capital Account (8-1)
    9) Trinniberg (15-1)
    10) Smiling Tiger (12-1)
    11) Amazombie (4-1)
    12) Hamazing Destiny (12-1)
    13) Poseidon’s Warrior (15-1)
    14) Boxeur des Rues (30-1)
    Mile
    1) Mr. Commons (12-1)
    2) Wise Dan (9-5)
    3) Obviously (6-1)
    4) Jeranimo (15-1)
    5) Animal Kingdom (8-1)
    6) Excelebration (2-1)
    7) Wilcox Inn (30-1)
    8) Suggestive Boy (15-1)
    9) Moonlight Cloud (6-1)
    Classic
    1) Pool Play (30-1)
    2) Flat Out (5-1)
    3) Alpha (20-1)
    4) Fort Larned (5-1)
    5) Game On Dude (9-5)
    6) Brilliant Speed (20-1)
    7) Handsome Mike (30-1)
    8) Nonios (20-1)
    9) Richard’s Kid (12-1)
    10) Ron The Greek (6-1)
    11) Mucho Macho Man (8-1)
    12) To Honor and Serve (8-1)
     
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  5. racer

    racer Yuma, where I work in software.
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    Call me a douche, but I'm pulling for Mizdirection in the turf sprint just because of Jim Rome being one of the owners.

    Also, any early bets to look at for this? Just getting my feet wet in regards to horse betting and I might lay a few bucks down on some of these just to get some more action in.
     
  6. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    Friday's selections:

    Juvenile Sprint: This race got less interesting with the defections of Beholder and Kauai Katie, and I’m disappointed that they went in the Juvenile Fillies because it will hurt the price on Super Ninety Nine, who I like in this spot. He ran very nicely in his debut at Santa Anita, and there is no reason he couldn’t improve in his second start. I think the only other horse that can win is the favored Merit Man, who won the local prep, the Tim Conway, but 5 ½ lengths last time out over South Floyd.

    Selection:
    1. 5- Super Ninety Nine (5-2)
    2. 3- Merit Man (8-5)
    3. 6- Hazardous (8-1)

    Marathon: A bit of a mystery, as most horses don’t run this far, particularly on dirt. The two most talented horses in this race are Atigun and Fame and Glory. If this was last year, Fame and Glory would be the clear favorite- even though he has never run on dirt. But he hasn’t been quite as good this year. At the odds he’ll be at, I’ll try and beat him. Atigun’s best race was his third in the Belmont, and he’s had trouble the past few races against good competition, yet didn’t run too poorly in them. Eldaafer is a veteran of this race, and won it in 2010. He’s in good form, and should be a contender. Not Abroad is also in good form, and ran well finishing second to Redeemed (who would have been the clear favorite in this race) in the Greenwood Cup. The two other horses that will be well bet, Worth Repeating and Jaycito, I’m not a fan of in this race- especially Jaycito. I’ll pick Atigun on top just because I think he is the best horse, and I do think that, despite being the morning line favorite, that he will drift up in price.

    Selection:
    1. 1- Atigun (9-2)
    2. 10- Eldaafer (8-1)
    3. 7- Not Abroad (5-1)

    Juvenile Fillies Turf: I have trouble going against the favored Sky Lantern in this race. I tend to like European horses in turf races, and she is a Group 1 winner over there. Beyond that, I don’t see a whole lot that really sticks out. A long shot that intrigues me just a bit is Flashy Ways, who won the local prep in the Surfer Girl last time out. Another one who could figure in the exotics is Waterway Run, who run a Group 3 race in England. Watsdachances and Spring Venture are good consistent horses, and they are not without a chance, but I don’t see a whole lot of difference between them and the aforementioned fillies, and they’ll be much better prices.

    Selection:
    1. 3- Sky Lantern (3-1)
    2. 13- Flashy Ways (10-1)
    3. 10- Waterway Run (10-1)

    Juvenile Fillies: This is a talented group of horses, but there are questions to answer for each of these horses. Executiveprivilege is the likely favorite. She’s undefeated with two Grade 1 wins and has the home court advantage. I just haven’t been impressed by her races. She’s a contender for sure, but I have trouble trusting her at the price she’ll be at. Two more short prices, Beholder and Kauai Katie, I’m not convinced want to go this far. Plus both have early speed, and I think they will tire each other out. I like Dreaming of Julia. She doesn’t have distance questions, and she has shown enormous talent with great breeding. If a horse emerges to win by 5+ lengths, she is the one. Spring in the Air does intrigue me a bit at a longer price. She needs to prove she can run on dirt, but she has already won at this distance on synthetic.

    Selection:
    1. 5- Dreaming of Julia (5-2)
    2. 2- Executiveprivilege (2-1)
    3. 3- Spring in the Air (15-1)

    Filly and Mare Turf: The two favorites will be a pair of Euro’s in The Fugue and Ridasiyna. I would give the edge to The Fugue, as I think she’ll appreciate the harder turf at Santa Anita. But both have beat quality European competition, and they’ll be tough to beat here. But there is good quality besides those two. Zagora, I’m A Dreamer, Nahrain, Up, and Marketing Mix could win, and I wouldn’t be stunned. Of those, I like I’m A Dreamer the most and Marketing Mix the least of that group. Still, there are some good prices to be found in this one, even if I am going chalk on top.

    1. 4- The Fugue (7-2)
    2. 11- I’m A Dreamer (8-1)
    3. 10- Ridasiyna (4-1)

    Ladies’ Classic: This is going to be a fantastic race. It all comes down to how you view Royal Delta. She is the most talented horse in the field, and she could very easily win by four lengths. She also is very capable of throwing in a clunker, and with a very deep field, I will take a shot against her. The second choice, Awesome Feather, is undefeated in ten starts, and ran her best career race last time out in the Nasty Storm. However, she hasn’t faced top competition in the majority of her races. I’ll try to beat her too. I’m going to look at the top two runners coming out of the Cotillion- My Miss Aurelia and Questing. While My Miss Aurelia- another undefeated horse- won by a head, I will take Questing on top. I still think her win in the Alabama was the most impressive race run by this group. On top of that, early speed has a tendency of doing well at Santa Anita, and she should be on the lead throughout.

    1. 4- Questing (4-1)
    2. 2- My Miss Aurelia (4-1)
    3. 6- Royal Delta (9-5)

    I'll do my Saturday picks sometime tomorrow.
     
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  7. captbunch

    captbunch Fan of: Texas Tech, Texas Rangers
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    thanks for this....love following your picks in horses.
     
  8. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
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    Nice post mtusc
     
  9. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    Saturday's Selections:

    Juvenile Turf: I think this is a race where you can take a shot against some of the favorites. The horse to beat is Dundonnell, a Group 3 winner from England. He could very well be the best horse in the race, but he’s faced small fields in his last two, and his races haven’t been all that much faster than many of the other Euro’s in the field (including a horse in Artigiano that intrigues me). For what it’s worth, the books in Europe have him as a clear favorite in this race. But I’ll try to beat him here. I also think this is a stronger American contingent than usual. There are a couple of American horses that are not without a shot (Balance the Books, Noble Tune, and Joha come to mind), but I’m going to go with a bit of a longshot in Dry Summer. He ran horribly last time out, but that was on dirt. His one turf effort the race before was impressive, and he will go off at much higher odds than I think he should.

    Selection:
    1. 11- Dry Summer (10-1)
    2. 2- Artigiano (8-1)
    3. 8- Balance the Books (8-1)

    Filly and Mare Sprint: I feel that the most obvious winner of this entire weekend is Groupie Doll. She’s not only the best sprinter in this race, but if she were entered into the Sprint with the males, she still may be favored. She’s won four in a row, all in graded company, and won all of them by at least three lengths against her competition, including a 7 length win over the second choice in this field and last year’s winner of this race, Musical Romance. I don’t see her faltering, but if she were, Dust and Diamonds ran well in her last two races.

    Selection:
    1. 9- Groupie Doll (Even)
    2. 3- Dust and Diamonds (9-2)
    3. 6- Turbulent Descent (5-1)

    Dirt Mile: There is a ton of early speed in this race, and in terms of race shape, Jersey Town will get a great setup. I just don’t trust him all that much. I think he’ll finish in the money because some other horses will fade down the stretch, but I just think a couple of horses are more talented than him. Shackleford, who won the Met Mile this year, and the Preakness last year, at his best is probably the best horse in this race. I just don’t think he’s in top form right now. Combine that with the early speed in the field, and he’s a favorite I’ll attempt to beat. I’m always wrong on this horse though, so take whatever I say about him with a grain of salt. The two horses I like are Emcee and Fed Biz. Emcee has been consistent all year, and handled Jersey Town last time out in the Forego. He also showed in that race that he can sit behind another horse if needed. As for Fed Biz, he’s a bit more guesswork. He does like this track, and probably has the most room to improve of the top horses.

    Selection:
    1. 7- Emcee (5-2)
    2. 5- Fed Biz (6-1)
    3. 3- Jersey Town (4-1)

    Turf Sprint: This race is a total crapshoot. My advice is to try not to take any horse at too low of odds in this one. The two horses that intrigue me are Corporate Jungle and Great Attack. I just happen to think that Corporate Jungle is the best horse in the race, and he’s facing easier competition in this spot. The question is whether or not this distance is too short for him. He also is 6-1 on the morning line, though I think he will drift up in price. Great Attack is proven at the distance, but he hasn’t raced since last May. Mizdirection has won a couple times on this track, though she is also unraced since May. She’ll also probably be the best price of the three. Those will be the three that will make up my top three, but anybody finishing in the top three would not be a total stunner to me. The order is based solely on odds for me. I assume Mizdirection will be the biggest price, so she’ll go on top.

    Selection:
    1. 11- Mizdirection (20-1)
    2. 8- Great Attack (10-1)
    3. 10- Corporate Jungle (6-1)

    Juvenile: Shanghai Bobby has done nothing wrong so far in his career, culminating in his impressive five length win in the Grade 1 Champagne. He’s been the best two year old so far, and is a deserving likely favorite in this race. My problem with him is that I just don’t think he’ll do better as the distances increase. If he beats me, he beats me. But I am going to try and beat him in this spot. I like a pair of Baffert horses in this spot in Power Broker and Title Contender. I really liked how they ran in each of their first starts on the dirt (and at Santa Anita). They both look similar to me, but Power Broker’s advantage is that he’s more seasoned and is proven at this distance. Fortify is interesting in this spot as well, though I don’t like him morning line odds. He reminds me a bit of Alpha.

    Selection:
    1. 9- Power Broker (5-2)
    2. 1- Title Contender (6-1)
    3. 8- Fortify (9-2)

    Turf: I think there is a pretty big gap between the top 3-4 horses and the rest of the field in this race. Point of Entry, St. Nicholas Abbey, Shareta, and Trailblazer are the horses that should dominate the betting. Point of Entry is the best American turf horse in some time, having won five consecutive races at or around this distance, including three Grade 1’s, and did so very easily. St. Nicholas Abbey won last year’s Turf, and while some people believe he’s not as good this year, I don’t necessarily agree with that. The Arc is a throwout- just horrible footing, and the horses he’s went toe-to-toe with on good footing are top of the line. These are the horses that have beaten him, with their ranking in the world according to Timeform: Frankel (1), Cirrus des Aigles (t-3), Danedream (t-8), Nathaniel twice (t-13), Snow Fairy (t-20) and Farhh (t-20). For what it’s worth, both Point of Entry and St. Nicholas Abbey are among the group tied for 20th (Dullahan is also part of that group, though his rating was earned on synthetic). Shareta ran second in last year’s Arc, and has beaten St. Nicholas Abbey both times that they have raced against each other. And the Japanese horse, Trailblazer, beat Shareta in their one race together (albeit last year), and came over early enough to run a race at Santa Anita. Personally, I like Shareta in this spot because I think she’ll be the best value, but I’d have a hard time arguing any order that those four are put in.

    Selection:
    1. 5- Shareta (7-2)
    2. 1- Point of Entry (3-1)
    3. 3- St. Nicholas Abbey (7-2)

    Sprint: Amazombie, who won last year’s Sprint, will likely be the favorite, and he is one I’ll be playing against. I just don’t think he is as good this year as he was last year. Coil, who won the local prep and should be the second choice, I just never have been able to trust. The other horse from that race, Capital Account, is my top pick in this race. There is enough early speed in this race that he should get a good trip. I also think there is a good group of three year olds that will contend- The Lumber Guy, Trinniberg, and Sum of the Parts. The only issue is that Trinniberg and Sum of the Parts will duel for the lead, and neither has shown they can win without the lead. Then, with The Lumber Guy, he needs to show that his impressive Vosburgh win was not a fluke (which I don’t think it was). It should be a fairly unpredictable race, but I think this is one where the favorites are vulnerable and you can get some good prices.

    Selection:
    1. 8- Capital Account (8-1)
    2. 7- The Lumber Guy (6-1)
    3. 9- Trinniberg (15-1)

    Mile: This is the race I am most looking forward to watching as a fan, even if it might not be the best betting race. The best two horses racing this weekend (and two of the top five horses in the world) are Wise Dan and Excelebration. Wise Dan is capable of running on any surface, but he’s really found a niche for himself his past three races going a mile on the turf. He’s been able to make good horses look like they are standing still when he’s made his move during the past three races. Excelebration, on the other hand, was unfortunate to have been born the same year as the undefeated Frankel, who may be the greatest turf miler of all time. He’s won three Group 1 races and finished second to Frankel in three additional Group 1 races. On top of that, his last race was the best of his career. I expect them to run 1-2 in some order, but there are some other interesting horses in this race. Moonlight Cloud was the closest to defeating the second best horse in the world, Black Caviar, losing by a head. She has attempted to go against Excelebration, though, and she finished fourth (though only beaten by a length and a half). Animal Kingdom won last year’s Kentucky Derby, and he’s always been one of my favorites, but he’s coming off of a lengthy layoff, and I think this might be too short of a distance for him. Obviously has emerged as the local contender, beating Trailblazer last time out, is in career form, and may be the lone speed. And Mr. Commons, while he struggles to win races, is capable of finishing third. I feel this race will be etched into Breeders Cup lore by the time this one is finished.

    Selection:
    1. 6- Excelebration (2-1)
    2. 2- Wise Dan (9-5)
    3. 3- Obviously (6-1)

    Classic:
    1) Pool Play (30-1)- You want to find a horse that could cause a huge payout? This has the potential to be one. He’s only run twice on dirt, but they are his two best races of his career- and they were both in graded stakes. He’ll also get a legitimate pace to run into. Do I think he will win? No. But if you can get him into the bottom of the exotics, it will pay very nicely. Exotics contender.
    2) Flat Out (5-1)- He’s won back to back Jockey Club Gold Cups, but I’ve always thought he was a better horse running in New York. He’s capable, but he’s also someone that I think you want to try and beat. Not using.
    3) Alpha (20-1)- Just don’t think he is fast enough to compete with this group at this point. Could be one of the top horses next year, but now is not the time for him. Not using.
    4) Fort Larned (5-1)- He’s been one of the most consistent horses all year long, and has run essentially the same race at each track he’s run at. He’s dangerous in this spot. Win contender.
    5) Game On Dude (9-5)- He has almost everything going in his favor. He consistently runs the fastest races of this group, is proven at the distance, and he runs his best races at Santa Anita. Top pick.
    6) Brilliant Speed (20-1)- He isn’t in his best form, and he runs his best races on the turf. Strange spot for him. Not using.
    7) Handsome Mike (30-1)- View him mostly as a pace presence. He’s not in this class of horses. Not using.
    8) Nonios (20-1)- Of the three year olds in this race, he probably has the most potential. But that isn’t saying much. All the worthwhile three year olds are already retired. Not using.
    9) Richard’s Kid (12-1)- I think he’s better on synthetic than he is on dirt, and he couldn’t beat Game On Dude on synthetic. For some reason, he’s getting some buzz in this race, and I don’t see it at all. Not using.
    10) Ron the Greek (6-1)- He’s won at this distance at this track in the Santa Anita Handicap, but that was a mediocre field and he got a meltdown pace to run into. He’s been one of the more consistent horses this year up until his last race. He’s hard to completely dismiss, but I don’t think he can win. Exotics contender.
    11) Mucho Macho Man (8-1)- He’s the third horse in this race that I think has the potential to win. There has been only one race he failed to show up in this year, and that was back in May (though he has been lightly campaigned). Outside of that, he’s been the best horse in each race against good competition, and that includes his second against To Honor and Serve last time. Win contender.
    12) To Honor and Serve (8-1)- He has as much talent as any horse in this race. He also needs everything to go his own way to have a chance. If it doesn’t, he folds immediately and does absolutely nothing. I don’t trust him at all. Not using.

    Selection:
    1. 5- Game On Dude
    2. 11- Mucho Macho Man
    3. 4- Fort Larned
    4. 1- Pool Play
     
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  10. racer

    racer Yuma, where I work in software.
    Donor
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    Thanks for doing all of that work, mtsucalico85 . :beerchug: It's appreciated by a newbie like me
     
  11. racer

    racer Yuma, where I work in software.
    Donor
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    Thoughts on Dullahan at 12-1 in the turf? He ran first against Classic favorite Game On Dude in August.
     
  12. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    I just think Dullahan happens to be a freak on a synthetic surface. His only three wins have been the three times he's raced on synthetics. His recent turf try in the Jamaica was poor, and this is a much stronger field.
     
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  13. rockportraider

    rockportraider Well-Known Member

    How do you bet these? Do you just do a W/P/S bet or combine different types such as exactas etc..?
     
  14. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    For the most part I do WPS betting. I used to do more trifecta's, but I've done those less and less the past year or so.

    What I am doing more of recently are Pick 3's and Pick 4's. If I can find a race where I can single a horse (and Groupie Doll I think is a horse you can single), you can spread out in the other races around it without having to bet too much money. And with the Breeders Cup, the amount of money you can make on a Pick 4 bet can be huge.
     
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  15. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    I haven't bet horses since I won $12.5k on the belmont and wasn't even going to look but guy at work started talking and I got the itch. So I will get the program tonight
     
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  16. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    Got my PPs

    Oh let do it today
     
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  17. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    Here are the full Friday PPs
     

    Attached Files:

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  18. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    Santa Anita Race 1

    $5 WPS - #11
    $2 Exacta Box - 1 8 11
     
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  19. Irish226

    Irish226 Well-Known Member
    Donor

    want to get some money down on the friday races, but apparently bookmaker isn't offering the friday BC races.
     
  20. rockportraider

    rockportraider Well-Known Member

    Don't have a clue about horse racing or odds/payout. Can you briefly explain it or link something that does a good job of explaining? Thinking about tailing some of these picks but just have no clue how it works. I also can't even find the Breeders Cup races that mtsucola has his write ups about. Thanks.
     
  21. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    $1 Pick 3, starting at Race 4:
    Race 4: 3,5
    Race 5: 1,7,10
    Race 6: 3,10,13
    Total Cost- $18

    $0.50 Pick 4, starting at Race 6:
    Race 6: 3,10,13
    Race 7: 2,3,5
    Race 8: 4,11
    Race 9: 2,4,6
    Total Cost- $27
     
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  22. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    Breeders Cup will be listed under Santa Anita. The first Breeders Cup race today is Race 4, the Juvenile Sprint

    This may be helpful: http://www.docsports.com/current/explain-horse-race-wagering.html
     
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  23. Irish226

    Irish226 Well-Known Member
    Donor

    Super ninety nine SCRATCHED
     
  24. rockportraider

    rockportraider Well-Known Member

  25. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    One of the biggest differences between horse betting and sports is that your odds are not locked. For instance if you bet Florida -16 tomororw, that is the number you get. Where as if you bet a 8-1 horse, the odds change the whole day. So you might bet the 8-1 horse right now and once the race starts it goes off at 3-1.

    WPS are Win Place Show. Means I made 3 bets of $5 on Win, Place & Show. Means I need the horse I picked to come 1st - 3rd. Preferably 1st or 2nd, that will make money.

    Exacta Box means you pick however many horses you want and box them. Which means in any combination they have to come 1st & 2nd. So my box of 1, 8 & 11 means I need 2 of those horses to come 1st & 2nd.
     
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  26. rockportraider

    rockportraider Well-Known Member

    Ok thanks for that detailed explanation it makes a lot more sense now. Now what about calculating payout for the exacta box? Obviously it will change through the day depending on what people are betting like you said but just generally how would I calculate the payout for exact box. Thanks again y'all.
     
  27. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    You really can't calculate it. Ill give you a more detail. All of legal horse racing money goes into a pool. So if $1,000,000 is bet on Exactas and only 10 people win, you get $100,000. So if there is $1,000,000 bet on the Win and 10,000 people had that horse to win, it pays you 10.00.

    Every $2 bet equals 1 bet.
     
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  28. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    There is really NO WAY that you can find out how much it will pay out until the pay outs come out.
     
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  29. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

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  30. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    I would also say don't tail me, I am not that good.

    Mtusc is 10x a better handicapper than I am
     
  31. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
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    What you think of the 2nd race of the day? That #7 is going to be tough to beat
     
  32. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    Also

    $2 Daily Double All/7 = $24 Total Bet
     
  33. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    Here we go ladies and gentleman.
     
  34. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    Didn't look at it until just now. I think the 7 wins, but the 10 could upset
     
  35. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    Im done already haha. I can't stand losing
     
  36. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    Will pay $31.00 if 7 wins
     
  37. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    $20 WPS 7
     
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  38. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
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    Always said just have to stop getting cute and bet big on the WPS that you like and I love this horse, shit odds but I just don't see him losing
     
  39. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    Pretty much exactly how it went down.

    7 beats the 10 by a length
     
  40. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    There's the 7-10 exacta
     
  41. captbunch

    captbunch Fan of: Texas Tech, Texas Rangers
    Donor TMB OG

    that for that...WPS both 7 and 10 and exacta them....cheers
     
  42. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    My buddy just hit everything in that race. $166 for the tri, $991 for the super
     
  43. captbunch

    captbunch Fan of: Texas Tech, Texas Rangers
    Donor TMB OG

    stupid question....

    when they put up the winning amounts...and it says 3.80.

    I know it is based off a $2 bet. Does the $3.80 mean you get your $2 back plus 3.80 = 5.80 or you just get 3.80, meaning you only profit 1.80.

    does that make sense?
     
  44. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    it means you $1.80 profit.
     
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  45. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
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    my $20 WPS paid me $28 profit.
     
  46. captbunch

    captbunch Fan of: Texas Tech, Texas Rangers
    Donor TMB OG

    ok..thanks.
     
  47. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    I like the 1 and the 7 the most in Race 3, but the 10 intrigues me at a big price. They all run well at Santa Anita, and while the 1 and 7 will be among the favorites, you could get the 10 at something like 20-1 or better. Currently at 29-1 early in the betting.
     
  48. mtsucalico85

    mtsucalico85 Well-Known Member
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    I am curious as to what price the 5, Basmati, goes off at. He hasn't raced since last December as a 2 year old, but he has faced far and away the best competition of anyone in the field, and for the most part didn't disgrace himself.
     
  49. captbunch

    captbunch Fan of: Texas Tech, Texas Rangers
    Donor TMB OG

    thanks again....

    had 1 and 7 as WPS and trifecta box 1, 5, 7, and 10.

    :beerchug:
     
  50. Wendel Clark

    Wendel Clark Gambling God
    Staff Donor

    Fuck i went to a meeting and missed it.