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Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by IrishLAX2, Dec 2, 2018.
Outside of like 2 posters ND is solid on TMB
Whoever wins the game, whether it be ND or Clemson, I want to do Bama dirty in the finals
How much time ya got buddy?
Pretty solid assessment.
I would say that using the USC game as a barometer doesn't necessarily do our secondary (particularly corners) justice. Troy Pride (who you guys are probably familiar with because he was a highly regarded guy from SC) has been banged up the past several weeks, and our overall game plan in the first half had as much to do with USC's success as our personnel (i.e. I'd say the players weren't put in a great position, thus somewhat poor results were to be expected). The consensus is that Pride will have a chance to get healthy over the next several weeks. Julian Love battled pretty well with JJ Arcega Whiteside earlier this year and is considered a first to second round talent. We have the guys to battle with your talent on the outside. In the slot we are fucked though, as others within the ND contingent have already mentioned. Our starting nickel DB missed the whole season and we've struggled to find the right personnel mix to effectively cover the slot while keeping our top 2 corners on the outside.
Another general thing to note is that our raw defensive stats are slightly skewed by the number of snaps that were played this season. In per play statistics, ND is stronger than what the raw total statistics in the write up suggest. ND finished 8th nationally in yards per play, which I think is more indicative of the success that side of the ball has had for us this year. We played several teams that are among the leaders in the country in offensive plays run and also haven't been great in 3rd/4th down conversions, so the number of snaps played pushes those totals up.
Also, ND has been impressive at making halftime adjustments this year, which seems like a weird thing to mention but it's something that has legitimately stuck out this season versus others. I'm usually one to downplay success/failure in that department, but the coordinators we currently have on staff are great minds that aren't afraid to alter the game plan and play off of certain opponent tendencies in real time. I'm too lazy to look up the stats, but ND has been elite in the 3rd quarter this season. With that said, we've not consistently gotten off to good starts offensively. I think coming out sharp in the first couple of offensive drives will be key for us. That doesn't necessarily mean scoring drives - referring more towards clean & mistake free football (somehow we fumbled the ball away on the first offensive drive of consecutive games).
Last thought - as a ND fan, if Alize Mack is the designated X-factor for us in the game offensively (as he suggests), then that's a little unnerving for us. Although he's been more consistent this year and has a ton of talent, him stepping up in a given game/situation is not really a bankable proposition on our end. Overall, I think we can win if we play our A game, but obviously a lot of things have to come together for that to happen.
How Did Clemson and Notre Dame Perform Against Common Opponents
After Clemson’s matchup against Pittsburgh in the ACC Championship game, the Tigers and the Fighting Irish share four common opponents: Syracuse, Wake Forest, Florida State, and now Pittsburgh. Despite sometimes being played in different venues, each team’s performances in these games actually paints a meaningful picture of how they compare heading into their Cotton Bowl matchup.
The first thing that stands out is that Notre Dame blew out Syracuse, while Clemson needed some Chase Brice heroics to salvage a victory, but after that you see Clemson won by 78 more total points over the other three games. When you dig into it a bit more, what’s really interesting is where those differences come from:
The defensive performances were relatively similar as Clemson has allowed 11 fewer points (2.8 fewer points allowed per game) than Notre Dame against their four common opponents. The Tiger offense however has posted 38 more points (9.5 more points per game!) in these four games than the Irish.
Both teams have had mid-season QB changes, which means season-long statistics can somewhat underrate the offenses, which improved once turning to more pass-oriented QBs. That said, Trevor Lawrence started all three of these games (though he left just before halftime of the Syracuse game), while Ian Book started three of the four (Wimbush started against Florida State).
It’s challenging to assess Notre Dame’s offense because of the QB change a quarter way through the year and RB Dexter Williams being suspended for the first four games. On the year, S&P+ ranks it 26th. After scoring just 23 points per game in their first three contests, they switched to QB Ian Book and blew up for 56 points in their next game. It was against Wake Forest though, so that’s only so impressive. From that point forward, they played 7 games in which they had both QB Ian Book and RB Dexter Williams. In those games they averaged a very solid 34 points per games. Clemson averaged 45 points per game (42 if you exclude the ridiculousness against Louisville).
This is the Trevor Lawrence effect. With an elite passing attack that fully leverages our WRs in the 9-spot - Higgins and Ross - the Tigers offense rates closer to Alabama’s vaunted 2018 attack than Notre Dame’s solid, but hardly lauded offense. (Interesting side note: OU’s #1 offense has such a big lead over everyone else that Clemson is closer to Notre Dame and OU.)
The Tigers defense may be somewhat stronger than Notre Dame’s, but it’s the Tiger offense that gives them a major advantage and makes them worthy of the double-digit spread the oddsmakers have given them.
The one worry that jumps out about Notre Dame’s offense comes from their WR Miles Boykin. Boykin has 803 yards and 8 TDs. Clemson shut down NC State’s star WR Kelvin Harmon (2 catches, 13 yards), but got burned by South Carolina’s star WR Deebo Samuel (10 catches, 210 yards, 3 TDs). If the Tigers can hold Boykin to a pedestrian performance, the Fighting Irish may not be able to score enough to best the Tigers.
yeah we don't have close to the depth that clemson does. i'm sure he stepped off the field at some point, but it's not an exaggeration to say coney (our mlb) played 99% of the snaps this year. tranquil would have done the same but he broke his hand and had a high ankle sprain that forced him to miss some time. *if* either of those guys go out for an extended period of time, we won't be able to stop clemson (if we're able to at all)
That was the same deal as our 2015 team, and one of the major drivers for our rotation strategy. That team was shot by the end of the year
Your hatred for ND is fun.
i hope BK does a better job with that going forward. our defensive recruiting has been elevated the past couple years (specifically as it relates to depth if not top-line players) so we should be able to rotate more (we were finally able to do that on the DL this year, just not at LB yet). but i was always jealous this year when i'd hear clemson played 70 players in a game or whatever the numbers were.
Hey pal, I speak for the entire nation when I say hatefully charged statements that are factually correct.
Im fully expecting you guys to meltdown like you did in 2015 after we beat that ass.
section 441. way up high, but on the 35 yard line. lets. fucking. go.
I think for 4 straight road games we played every player on the travel roster. The next one we played 70/72. We regularly play 50+ in the first quarter/half.
You already melted down twice over Nd wins this season
Venables wasn't a fan when we started but said he gets it after seeing the results. In 2015 we just had garbage for depth on the defense. After that we our recruiting picked up so subbing more was possible against good competition. Imagine it helps with recruiting now too because nearly everyone gets their chance on the field if they earn it in practice
Bro....Let's do this.
#Dallas Cowboys i thought i saw you should try and get parking based on your seat location, but i can't find that information now. if i'm in section 441, where should i try and buy a parking pass? or does it not matter?
this is what i was referring to. should i try and get lot 10 or 11?
edit again: my choices are 13, 14, or 15. thoughts?
we are in 13 section 347
using gate C
He also thinks it takes 18 hours to cook a turkey
Is Trop Kyle or what? It seems like he's Kyle
If he was Kyle you wouldn't have to ask
Willing to tell you who Trop is for 2 tickets to the game.
trop is a congressman
Why am I not surprised.
He’s terrible on every board he posts on.
Way to ruin my grift
Clemson fans I was checking out your recruiting classes to see how your squad was put together. Ya’lls senior and junior classes are nasty
Why though has your OL cruiting fallen off a cliff recently? It’s very reminiscent of what happened to FSU under Jimbo which has got to terrify you guys
That question has permeated our private board for years
It’s not exactly a great situation (our OL coach is a good developer but not a great recruiter). To be fair though, FSUs issues are much greater than just their oline. We’re in really good shape outside of OL, and maybe safety which has been hit or miss.
Jimbo recruited four star OL in great quantity- they just sucked. Our situation is a little different but I get your point.
Look at our 2013 and 2014 classes- we took 4 OL total those two classes and it worked out pretty well for their careers.
It is our worst recruiting area by far, but if we can close with Putnam we already have a promising group committed for next year.
Florida kids are mostly overrated trash these days especially on the OL. That state produces 50 “four stars” every year and most of them disappear to never be seen again after signing day
ND just decided to quit recruiting Florida all together and move those yearly scholarships to Kentucky, Georgia, and Tennessee kids instead
Has worked out very well so far
We recruit FL but we are generally pretty selective with our offers. It has also worked out well for us. Lots of NFL players with relatively few head cases.
CB Trayvon Mullen is our only starter from FL right now.
We have several from FL in this upcoming class though, including Chez Mellusi, a RB we beat y’all out for.
the ND part of the story here is that apparently the staff told him not to come
The story from the ND side is Chez called ND saying he wanted to take an official over the summer and ND said no. ND wanted to slow play Chez. He committed to y’all shortly after.
ND wanted Kyren Williams or Steele Chambers more. They got Williams, so it worked out for everyone I think
I think you might be surprised if you go back and look where our past classes rank nationally, not just on the OL but overall. Great hit rate + development + 5 stars sprinkled in has been our winning recipe. We leave the star chasing and underachieving to the Georgias.
I love how you care about your e-cred. Cute.
Hows the club level at jerry world?
In The Film Room . . . Clemson Tigers (Part I)
ByTim Prister 28 minutes ago
(Photo: Cory Fravel, 247Sports)
In the days leading up to the Dec. 29 Cotton Bowl against Clemson, Irish Illustrated will offer analysis/insight of the more interesting matchups we see with Notre Dame while continuing to study the Tigers’ game film from the 2018 season to comment on individual performers.
In the first of an anticipated three-part series, we explore some of the issues Clemson’s defense had when it did show (infrequent) vulnerability, the strong interior defensive line play, a matchup that appears to favor Notre Dame’s defense, and the dilemma presented by the Clemson offense.
LATE IN THE SEASON, CLEMSON’S DEFENSE
(Photo: Cory Fravel, 247Sports)
Late in the season, Clemson's defense had real difficulties getting lined up at times, causing confusion and leading to big plays, particularly by South Carolina in the final regular-season game.
In the Boston College game, Chris Fowler and Kirk Herbstreit mentioned defensive coordinator Brent Venables’ desire to make a change on his defensive alignment/responsibilities a split second before the snap. This led to players on all levels of the defense unprepared for the snap as they looked to the sideline.
“(Venables) wants to see what (South Carolina’s offense) is in and (the Clemson defense) has no idea what they’re doing,” Herbstreit said.
South Carolina quarterback Jake Bentley threw for 510 yards and five touchdowns, including touchdown passes of 67, 75, 32 and 20 yards. Nearly half of the 11 touchdown passes allowed by Clemson this year came against the Gamecocks.
They weren’t just out of sync; they were thoroughly confused. Similar confusion occurred in the Boston College game, although once defensive tackle Christian Wilkins injured Eagles quarterback Anthony Brown, there wasn’t much of a passing game.
Just something to keep an eye. If Chip Long can confuse the Tigers with formations/alignments, the Tigers could be caught off guard if Venables insists on making the last-second front/coverage adjustments.
CLEMSON’S SAFETY PLAY
(Photo: Cory Fravel, 247Sports)
Clemson's safety play can be exploited in the passing game and when putting them in open-field tackle situations.
Make no mistake, 6-foot-1, 230-pound free safety Tanner Muse (No. 19) will pursue the football and strike you. But Muse will take some shallow angles to the football and his anticipation of where the football is being distributed through the air can leave him a step or two behind.
Both Muse and strong safety K’Von Wallace (No. 12) will duck their heads and lunge into tackles, which could create some yards after the catch or a missed tackle of Dexter Williams on the second level. Nickel/outside linebacker Isaiah Simmons (No. 11) has great size (6-foot-2, 230) and versatility. He’s a bit of a freak athlete in that he can play both the run and pass effectively at his size. But he, too, will lunge and lose his discipline at times.
Clemson’s cornerback play is strong. Junior Trayvon Mullen (No. 1) is expected to leave for the NFL after the playoffs. A.J. Terrell (No. 8) has nice bounce/change of direction and is a physical tackler/run defender. The Irish need to put those safeties on an island and exploit their shortcomings because it’s uncertain exactly how much headway Notre Dame’s wideouts can get against the Clemson cornerbacks.
CHRISTIAN WILKINS HAS AN UNCANNY ABILITY
(Photo: Cory Fravel, 247Sports)
Christian Wilkins has an uncanny ability to get unblocked and stay unblocked. Listed at 6-foot-4, 315 pounds, he looks squatter than that. But Wilkins (No. 42) is quick and slippery and a real handful as a combination three-technique/nose tackle. He can overpower an offensive lineman, but he also can crease a gap. He is going to be an absolute handful for Notre Dame’s interior offensive line, which is compounded by his inside running mate – Dexter Lawrence (No. 90) – who is a mere 6-foot-4, 350 pounds.
Both will play in the NFL. Lawrence is gargantuan. In my opinion, Wilkins’ ability to get off blocks will make him the better professional player.
IN CASE YOU WERE WONDERING
(Photo: Ryan Bethea, 247Sports)
In case you were wondering if Clemson’s defensive line gets held by opposing offensive lines as much as Notre Dame’s does, rest assured. The Notre Dame fan base is not the only one complaining about its defensive line getting held without the benefit of a flag. Most opponents have no choice against Notre Dame and Clemson but to hold, and they tend to get away with it.
A MATCHUP THAT FAVORS NOTRE DAME IS
(Photo: Matt Cashore, 247Sports)
A matchup that favors Notre Dame is defensive end Khalid Kareem vs. right tackle Tremayne Anchrum (No. 73). Anchrum, a 6-foot-2, 310-pound junior and a new starter for the Tigers in 2018, can be beaten off the edge. He’s a better run blocker than pass blocker. He showed vulnerability against 6-foot-5, 285-pound Boston College defensive end Zach Allen, who is very good and will be a high draft pick.
But Anchrum lacks some quick twitch, which also should make him vulnerable to Kareem, who can be extremely quick off the snap of the football. Clemson employs an H-back virtually every play with Garrett Williams (No. 44) and Milan Richard (No. 80), both of whom are effective (although Williams more so). You may see Clemson giving Anchrum some help on Kareem.
Left tackle Mitch Hyatt (No. 75), who started against the Irish as a freshman in 2015, is much more agile and light on his feet. But he’ll have Julian Okwara and Daelin Hayes to deal with, which should be an interesting matchup as well. That matchup is on a bit more of a level playing field. Look for Kareem to have some success against Anchrum.
IT’S PRETTY COMICAL TO SEE
(Photo: Cory Fravel, 247Sports)
It's pretty comical to see Clemson strength coach Adam Smotherman, who is assigned to reel in the emotional Brent Venables along the Tiger sideline. Venables gets wound up and strays onto the field as he’s yelling instructions to the defense. Smotherman will reach forward and grab Venables by the collar or even bend at the knees and wrap his arms around Venables’ waist to pull him back behind the sideline. Check it out.
I DON’T SEE HOW NOTRE DAME
(Photo: USA TODAY Sports)
I don't see how Notre Dame will run the football successfully between the tackles. Wilkins and Lawrence are going to win the majority of the battles against Notre Dame’s interior offensive line. Wilkins can beat you physically and with speed while Lawrence does it more with sheer size and power.
Chip Long can get this defensive line on the run with misdirection-type stuff that challenges the eye discipline of a front that really wants to get upfield. Notre Dame’s inroads running the football will have to be created with deception because Clemson’s starting interior defensive line is too stout.
The exception to the rule is when Nyles Pinckney (No. 44) and Albert Huggins (No. 67) sub in at defensive tackle. Both get about 20 snaps per game. Pinckney in particular strikes me as someone the Irish could go right after. He doesn’t always move his feet and can get turned around a la Notre Dame’s Micah Dew-Treadway.
THE DILEMMA NOTRE DAME’S DEFENSE FACES
(Photo: Cory Fravel, 247Sports)
The dilemma Notre Dame's defense faces is the one that Clemson’s opposition has faced all season. The Tigers have scored at least 35 points in 10 out of 13 games and can beat you in a multitude of ways.
Herbstreit summed it up best when he said: “This offense is so hard to defend because it’s balanced but also explosive running it and throwing it. If you bring an extra hat up from safety, you leave the talented quarterback and receivers one-on-one.”
Clemson is No. 2 in 20-yard runs (40), No. 2 in 30-yard runs (22), No. 4 in 40-yard runs (12) and No. 2 in 50-yard runs (10). They’re also No. 5 in 40-yard passes (18) and No. 7 in 50-yard passes (10). It creates a fascinating matchup against Notre Dame’s No. 3 pass defense per attempt (5.4).
So do you run from a base defense and leave Asmar Bilal on a slot receiver or do you work out of nickel and leave yourself more vulnerable to Travis Etienne (No. 9), who is averaging 8.3 yards per carry with 21 touchdowns? Clemson’s other three backs – Lyn-J Dixon (No. 23), Adam Choice (No. 26) and Tavien Feaster (No. 28) – are averaging 9.6, 7.4 and 5.8 yards per carry respectively.
Etienne is an outstanding back. He has burst when a sliver of a hole opens up, but he also shows good power for a 200-pound back. Feaster is the one who stands out among the rest at 220 pounds. He is more power than burst, but still a guy who can run past you if he has a hole.
If you gear up to stop the run, Clemson and quarterback Trevor Lawrence (No. 16) will RPO you into submission with a bevy of talented receivers that we’ll explore in our next In The Film Room . . . Clemson Tigers (Part II).
This. Not sure who you guys ended up with, but he must be very good.
when and where did he say this?
That can’t be real
3star, regional offers. Versatile though- Kelly loves RBs that can catch the ball