Yea I was actually agreeing with your overall attempt at a solution. It would probably still get massive pushback but I'll take pretty much any progress at this point.
This is a flawed example but it take's me an absurd amount of time to get final sign-offs for liquor licenses in California, extensive background checks, on some occasions a public hearing. In JH, I can buy a gun with no waiting period and no permit required to open carry.
Oregon VOTERS just passed the most stringent gun licencing program in the nation in order to track purchases, require gun training prior to purchase and ban magizines more than 10 rounds. Local Sheriffs and Governments are already saying they not going to comply, gun nuts are losing their minds and it will probably get overturned by the Gun Lobby friendly Supreme Court. Legit no meaningful gun legislation change will ever happen. Best bet is to become numb to these shootings because they will continue to happen for the rest of our lives. Eat Arby's.
Gun nuts are seriously getting rabid over this as well. They are going to kill people over this Measure
"I have no real personality other than having a tiny dick and needing to own Assault Rifles made for a warzone!"
SCOTUS isn’t going to allow any gun reform of substance to stand for long. I think the only way things change is enough time passes that every American has a direct connection to a shooting. Unfortunately at this rate, it isn’t going to take more than a few decades. Even with media coverage of these shootings, it’s too easy to see it as someone else’s problem, and believe that it can never happen to you. On one hand, it’s up to the Millenials or Gen Z to solve this problem. On the other, Gen Z grew up in a world where mass shootings are the norm and they may not recognize that’s it’s not supposed to be normal.
"Nothing you can do, folks. Although the (anti) Second Amendment people, maybe there is. I don't know."
"We can't ban assault weapons because then you'll ending up taking all the weapons." Also, "we have to ban all abortions, and fuck the consequences of that action."
Okay, so from the perspective of someone who is somewhat knowledgeable about gun laws, I can tell you that you're going to run into issues here when it comes to definitions. This is where the gun industry/community thrives on loopholes. It's a double edged sword. If you leave the legal definition vague, then it's easy for the gun industry to claim all sorts of things aren't restricted based on the vagueness of the definition, and if you provide specific legal definitions it's even easier for the gun companies to circumvent those laws. Here is a great example: This is a mossberg 590: This is the mossberg 590 shockwave: The shockwave is identical to the standard 590 in every way. Same caliber, same internal mechanisms, same pump action design, however it has a much shorter barrel and a very short grip. In fact, if you bought a standard 590 and modified it to be like the shockwave, you would be committing a federal crime. However, purchasing and owning the shockwave is perfectly legal, because it has been legally defined as "not a shotgun". There's millions of examples of gun control laws being circumvented like this. Effective gun control is going to have to involve a total overhaul of how gun laws are interpreted and enforced.
I can understand being antagonistic towards people who are against gun control, but being antagonistic towards people simply for being knowledgeable about guns is fascinating. Sorry for being a southern male who served in military, I guess. God forbid people discussing gun laws are aware of how gun laws are currently failing, and could be more effective.
Aioli is not being a weirdo at all, he’s offering a very relevant example of how gun laws are whacky. You’re being weird by painting him as a RWNJ gun loving freak — and save the ink telling me about his past posts on gun ownership, I’ve seen them.
I don't need to know anything about guns bc I'm in favor of melting all of them. Does it fire a bullet? OK melt it. See, easy.
Ahh yes I actually need to become an expert in guns so I can ask nicely if Bubba will give up his one obscure gun. He'll say no, so what's the point? Sorry for actually wanting something that will actually do something, not some half-assed legislation that keeps the nut jobs happy and does nothing to address the real problem. I know it'll never happen but I can still wash it would. Anything that will actually happen is pointless bc we bend over backwards to appease the nutjobs.
Fine. I'll give up my feet, no problem. I really hate guns. I can't stress that enough. More than I hate Tennessee, in fact.
But why does this happen? It happens because the NRA is very powerful and pushes politicians/judges/regulatory agencies, both large and small, to support laws and lawsuits that always side with opening up more avenues of revenue for them. In a rational world, when that Shockwave shotgun is shown and its asked "is this a semi-auto, short barrelled shotgun?" any reasonable lawmaker/Judge would say "umm yes". In our current gun crazed and GOP NRA lobbied society, you will get 40% of the lawmakers/public on your side if you are just trying to expand access to any sort of guns. "Well actually the grip is .25" inches shorter than the 1887 patent for the shotgun, so my verdict is it's free and clear to sell!!!" This has happened time and time again. What it has amounted to is a DRASTICALLY more lethal weapons and components being available for sale than ever before. People weren't able to buy silencers, 30 round mags, semi-auto everything, assault rifles, body armor so easily 25-30 years ago... but now you talk about doing any single thing to try and curb gun violence and mass shootings and it's amount to treason. Basically, fuck all of them. People need to grow some fucking balls and put the gun lobby in their place.
Jesus, man. Just put him on ignore if you can't stand reading his informational post, and stop cunting up the thread. As someone who doesn't know much about the topic, I appreciate the knowledge drop.
Fuck that. Deep diving into definitions is exactly what they want. That's where they win. They make it so complicated that nothing gets done. Things get bogged down in the minutiae. We talk about "common sense" gun legislation but then they veer into the details and you have to be a gun nut to understand it so you're playing into their hands. It doesn't have to be that complicated.
When the NFA was enacted, “sawn-off” shotguns were a larger relative problem because the market wasn’t saturated with easily-concealed, large caliber, high capacity handguns and carbines. I get the point about bad definitions creating bad legislation, but that Mossberg Shockwave (and similar grey-area niche guns) nearly a hundred years after the legislation came out doesn’t really change the fact that something is better than noting.
Ownership limitations are a key, in my opinion. If an individual can only own one or maybe two firearms then I’d imagine that more utility-based weapons like the shotgun would begin to comprise the majority of what is manufactured and distributed. I’d guess a handful of whackos would buy the most destructive thing they could get their hands on, but that doesn’t seem like it would be all that widespread. Maybe I’m wrong on that, idk.
I would love to have to worry about exceptions getting around the rule rather than just the horrifying ease at which even people on a goddamned terrorism watch list can purchase mass killing machines.
Exactly. Something like 4 million AR-15s are sold yearly. A mostly-useless, niche pump shotgun with a max 7 round capacity, 40 yard effective range, and sales in the thousands is a distraction.
And not to pile on, because his point was a real issue, but we’d be a much safer society if a Mossberg 590 shockwave replaced every handgun in the country.
They also make those types of guns like this. Which opens up another can of worms. This gun isn’t meant for hunting, it’s meant to kill people.
But, it’s terrible at it and like a few hundred exist. You can get an AR-15 at Academy that can kill a football team from 3x the range in a few seconds without any modifications.
Oh yeah, fuck AR’s. Absolutely no need to have one unless you’re wanting to kill a lot of people. That’s it. Fuck a crybaby whining about hog hunting.
Seems somewhat relevant, but there’s been a huge uptick in cars getting broken into here in Houston. Police said that the criminals are looking for guns, not laptops, your radio, etc. So yes, if we didn’t have guns here then criminals who couldn’t buy them wouldn’t be able to steal them from other people. Also funny that they target people with stickers for the NRA and conservative bullshit because they know they probably have a gun in the car. Karma https://www.khou.com/amp/article/ne...ents/285-d44f41a9-efce-4db4-919f-72130346102b
Yeah, it's the Dem Mayor and Gov that are in a deep red state with a 70% GOP legislature that are at fault for the lack of gun control in the state.
Same shit happened in Virginia. I don't see why all of these people aren't arrested for literally breaking the law