I never said he should stand there. The guy was climbing out of a car that had just flipped several times. Odds are he's not going to take off like a race horse. As NNB said, this was just a regular bail out. There was no reason for the cop to fear for his or the public's safety. There's absolutely no reason for him to pull his gun there. If the guy does take off running, he cop has no business shooting him. The cop should be worried about the safety of the guy that was in a car that flipped 3 times. It's a sad fucking day when you can't get out a wrecked car without being shot by a cop.
No doubt. The next person that thinks about wrecking on that cop's streets will think twice about it.
No but the next asshole that kills someone after drunk driving might. Maybe don't kill someone while drunk driving and you won't get shot.
Look boys, I agree with you that the dude did not deserve to get shot. I'm assuming positive intent, you're assuming negative intent. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.
I just don't see the positive intent. If he didn't plan on shooting him, why did he draw his gun to start with?
My contention is the cop wanted to shoot him. Why did he shoot him? I have no idea. Maybe he thought the guy was a super bad guy that was going to get out guns blazing like in the movies. Maybe he thought the guy was going to attack him after he got out. I can't answer that question. The facts are the cop treated the guy like a duck on Duck Hunt. He popped out and he shot him. Instead of trying to help the guy out of the car, the cop was pulled his gun on him. There's really no legit excuse for the cop to have ever drawn his gun. He should have been trying to help the guy.
Ok, Well with all due respect, dbl, I feel your contention is a little more "fantasy land" than the idea of him simply accidentally pulling the trigger. That's the difference in what you're assuming, and what I'm assuming. Like I said, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle. It usually is in these kind of things.
I can accept that given the nature of police work today and the fact that the guy was scrambling fairly quickly out of the vehicle that the officer may have reacted in th way he's been trained to control the situation and drew his gun. I can accept that given that situation, it's possible for a gun to accidentally fire with disastrous results. I can't accept that those things happen and the cop doesn't tell anyone. I can't accept that the in radio call immediately after the event, he characterizes the driver's behavior as "refusing to exit the vehicle." An honest but tragic mistake is one thing - being willing to let someone die because you refuse to acknowledge that mistake is another.
I definitely agree it was handled horribly by the shooter. But I'm also not about to pretend to know what the mindset is of someone who just pulled a trigger and hit someone is like.
But these are the people we task with that responsibility. They need to be able to demonstrate the ability to appreciate the gravity of that responsibility and behave appropriate when they exercise it. At the very least, he should not be a cop anymore.
I can with some certainly that that gun didn't accidentally jump out of it's holster and into his hands. At the very least he purposefully drew his gun and aimed it at a civilian that had just flipped his vehicle and was trying to save his own life.
Well then you better email the Butte county prosecutor's office. It appears they have made a mistake.
Would give that cop a like IRL. That fucker looked like one of those prairie dogs getting shot and falling back into his hole.
With all the dumb shit Farva says, it seems weird to get bent out of shape over him trying to understand the situation from the cop's perspective. It didn't even seem like he was siding with the officer, more just offering possible explanations for what might have gone through his mind And now I've sided with Farva. Giving myself a tmb time out
How is that not criminal negligence? Isn't this everything gun safety people worry about? Aren't you only suppose to put your finger on the trigger if you intend to shoot? His motivations don't matter, his actions do. There was a man shot who posed no threat at any time. Yes, the cop perceived a threat, but oops I accidentally shot is not a reason to evade punishment. Stupidity is not a valid defense.
Aren't there accidental shootings all the time that don't result in criminal charges? The guy should definitely be punished for the actions afterwards and probably shouldn't be a cop anymore, if for no other reason than he can't handle the stress and pressure pretty clearly. But dbl acting like the guy just wanted to shoot someone is pretty far out there.
I don't think he woke up that morning wanting to shoot someone. As he walked to the car, I do think he intended to shoot anything he deemed a threat, though. That's why he had his gun out and ready to shoot. I just don't buy it being an accidental discharge.
More chance it was truly accidental than he just wanted to shoot the guy IMO. You don't feel that way obviously.
He didn't accidentally pull his gun out. He didn't accidentally aim it at the guy. He didn't accidentally put his finger on the trigger. Knowing those things, I don't buy he accidentally pulled the trigger.
He took out the gun pointed it and holstered it after he shot the guy. He than went and checked in the car. Checked the dead woman. Nothing about what he did says accident. It seems like he fucked up and knew he did and attempted to cover it up. I think the cop is a POS but so is the driver. The narrative of "next time a guy will think twice about having a wreck" you and hoss were starting was really disingenuous. Did the he deserve to be shot? No. But he wasn't simply a guy who had a wreck and was shot. He was a POS who killed someone and put countless others in danger. Sorry that I am not sorry that he got shot. FWIW as soon as the cop drives up he says he will need medics and he says the woman is unresponsive. He might have seen her fly out the car and assumed she was dead. That does not change the fact the dude didn't deserve to be shot. Just might give some perspective of why he thought the guy was going to run or be combative and that's why he pulled his gun.
And if he did accidentally shoot the guy, he would have acted like it. He would have scrambled trying to help the guy. He would have done everything to save the guy. He did nothing. He tried to cover it up. He shot the guy and kept right on hoping nobody would notice.
I'm sure there are instances, particularly when it's one friend shooting another (Cheney). But having video, and knowing the circumstances shows clear neglect for firearm safety resulting in severe bodily harm. Seems to fit the bill for negligence or something akin. There's also negligence for knowingly shooting someone then not saying anything about it.
I agree. He should be charged with vehicular manslaughter. I read earlier he will be and I'm ok with that. That has nothing to do with the cop's actions, though. We can all agree the driver was in the wrong but he shouldn't have been shot for it.
You do realize you can do all of that and still accidentally pull the trigger right? Is safe or standard or should a cop be retained that doesn't demonstrate safety with a firearm? No. But that doesn't mean he intentionally shot him. Good thing our opinions don't matter though.
This. I don't agree with it being an accidental discharge, but even if it's deemed that, it doesn't discard the fact that he covered it up and could have let the guy die by doing so. At the very least he should be charged for that.
We agree that his actions after definitely demand punishment, criminal punishment at that. You can be negligent and not criminally right? I'm sure he'll be found negligent in a civil court.
Knowing he did all of those things on purpose, what makes you think he pulled the trigger on accident? Bc he's a cop and he said so? We know this guy already tried to cover the whole thing up. Why should I take his word for it? If that was a civilian that shot another civilian, 100% of people would say he shot him on purpose.
Shooting in mid stride, flinching when he shot, immediately holstering after (they are trained to shoot twice right?). He probably tried to cover it up because he realized he fucked go and he absolutely should be punished for that.
They are also trained to not shoot civilians that pose no threat and not to lie to cover up things. This guy has shown in multiple ways that he doesn't really follow the training book.
No one is saying he did or that be should be a cop still. That doesn't mean he intentionally shot him.
If he thought the guy posed a threat would you change your mind that the shot might have been accidental? Say he saw the woman fly out. Say that when he pulled up he saw that she wasn't moving and maybe he realized she was dead. He sees the guy come up thinking that the guy knows he is in deep shit he pulls his gun to tell him not to go anywhere. Unfortunately the gun goes off. Could you buy that?
I highly doubt he intentionally shot that dude. However, his gun being out and up is normal, his finger being on the trigger is not, its unsatisfactory and his accidental/negligent discharge is the exact reason why.
1. No, the guy is no threat. He should never pull his gun on a guy that is no threat. 2. He never said a word to the guy.
It's always fun to flip this around and consider what would happen. If I "accidentally discharge" my legally owned firearm in the same manner as in the video, and shoot a cop in the neck.....what happens to me?
This is exactly where I am. The way the guy crashed the shit out of his car then is trying to get out like he is, is suspicious to me. I'm fine with the cop pulling a gun. But at that point don't you say - don't move, put your hands where I can see them, bla bla bla? You wouldn't just stand there with your gun drawn, right? Then when an accident happens, you don't ignore it, what about - shots fired, shots fired! - ? Casually holstering your gun then milling around looking for the casing? He seems to do some things very technically by the book, and then do other things very off the books. And the things he does off the books are all things that make him look bad or that might get him in trouble.
Because he is approaching a situation where he is unsure of what's going on and he thought it necessary to have his gun out. It's dealers choice. There is nothing that says your gun has to be out or up, and there is nothing that says it can't. Strictly up to the officer on scene. The fact is the gun being out isn't the reason he shot that guy, he shot that guy bc he pressed the trigger. He exhibited poor weapons handling skills and judgement.
Assuming the guy actually had a knife, this is probably the wrong thread for that shoot. Cop gave verbal warnings and gave a lot of ground before firing.