Baseball History Thread

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by bhrangerfan0809, Aug 3, 2015.

  1. Tobias

    Tobias dan “the man qb1” jones fan account
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    definite hall of famer when the baseball writers decide to stop punishing him for playing in the steroid era
     
    #251 Tobias, Aug 6, 2015
    Last edited: May 2, 2019
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  2. miles

    miles All I know is my gut says, maybe
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    Was Ozzie Smith overrated?

    I kind of thought so until I looked at career defensive war and he has 43. No one within 4 of him and only 7 guys above 30. I may need to revise my previous statement ITT
     
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  3. KJROD20

    KJROD20 the ends will justify the means.
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    I had him as a first ballot HOF, so to me he's underrated.
     
  4. Celemo

    Celemo tell 'em Steve-Dave
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    he was in the movie "The Scout"
     
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  5. HOOSINSC

    HOOSINSC You're with me leather
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    Was just looking at Willie McGee's stats. He probably would be in the 3k hit club if he could have stayed healthy. His triples and SB numbers would have taken a nice jump too.

    Man I wish Eric Davis and Vince Coleman could have stayed healthy.
     
  6. MG2

    MG2 I like to give away joy for free
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    I was once tagged in the Rangers thread and asked about my thoughts on Piazza v. Pudge. If you want to make Ranger fans really mad sometime, tell them you think Piazza was as good or better than Pudge.
     
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  7. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    Has there ever been a baseball player with a shorter name than catcher for the 1979 World Series Pirates, Ed Ott?

    I don't know the answer, but I find that the easiest way to find the answer is not Google, but instead to assert the answer as fact on a message board and then wait for everyone to prove it wrong.

    Ed Ott had the shortest name in baseball history.
    [​IMG]
     
  8. cal

    cal BOATS
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    he will retire as the greatest ball player that ever lived
     
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  9. Festus McBadass

    Festus McBadass Cool ass dog and 5 star recruit
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    Tuesday was the first time in baseball history that all 15 home teams won on the same night.
     
  10. enjj

    enjj Well-Known Member
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  11. bhrangerfan0809

    bhrangerfan0809 Sprinkles are for Spelling Bee Winners™
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    On this day in baseball history (1988)...

     
  12. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    Game One is tonight. NPR had a decent interview with Bob Gibson on my morning drive to work, talking to Gibson about setting the World Series record while striking out 17 in Game One in 1968.

    Gibson started 34 games in 1968 and pitched 28 complete games with 13 shutouts. His 1.12 ERA is the 4th lowest in major league history and there isn't another pitcher in the top-40 that pitched after the end of the dead ball era.

     
  13. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    Probably also worth mentioning that Gibson's Cardinals lost to the Detroit Tigers 4-3 in the 1968 series. The Tigers had Denny McClain, who won 31 games in 1968 (let's not turn this into a discussion about WAR). McClain is one of only three pitchers to win 30 or more after the end of the dead ball era. The other two were Dizzy Dean in 1934 and Lefty Grove in 1931.

    Gibson shut down the Tigers in Games 1 and 4, going head-to-head with McClain. Detroit shuffled their starters and had McClain pitch Game 6, he won, sending it to Game 7.

    Gibson lost Game 7 opposite Mickey Lolich, who went 3-0 in the series and was named MVP, despite pitching in the same series as two pitchers who compiled the most wins and lowest ERA of any two pitchers in the last 80 years.
     
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  14. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    On January 27, 1937, Cincinnati suffered the worst flood in the city's history, covering Crosley Field. Reds' pitcher Lee Grissom rowed out to the pitchers mound for a publicity photo that the team sent to ticket holders to assure them that the field would be ready for opening day.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
     
  15. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

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  16. bhrangerfan0809

    bhrangerfan0809 Sprinkles are for Spelling Bee Winners™
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    So I created an Excel spreadsheet that uses functions to compare players' levels of dominance across different eras. I'm using a very simple method, basically just working with equivalent fractions. Here's an example with Walter Johnson:

    1912 Walter Johnson ERA X
    ____________________ = _____________________

    1912 MLB Average ERA 2015 MLB Average ERA

    *formatting sucks, it should read
    (1912 Walter Johnson ERA/1912 MLB Average ERA)=(x/2015 MLB Average ERA)


    I did this with several other players, too. I took their three best seasons (by WAR) and used the above calculations to find out what a player's stats would look like if they dominated the 2015 MLB like, say, Babe Ruth dominated the MLB in 1927. I'll throw out some of my findings (be prepared for some bizarre numbers):

    Hank Aaron: .334, 38 HR
    Lou Gehrig: .330, 89 HR
    Ted Williams: .363, 84 HR
    Babe Ruth: .333, 145 HR
    Pete Reiser: .306, 27 HR, 30 SB
    (per 550 AB)

    Walter Johnson: 1.81 ERA, 12.5 K/9
    Old Hoss Radbourn: 2.41 ERA, 9.8 K/9

    Do any of you guys have suggestions that would improve this method for comparing players across different eras while keeping it relatively simple/quick?
     
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  17. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    You realize they already have stats the take era into account, right?
     
  18. bhrangerfan0809

    bhrangerfan0809 Sprinkles are for Spelling Bee Winners™
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    For some reason I forgot about the neutralized stats section on baseball-reference. Whoops.
     
  19. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    Check out stats like ERA+, OPS+, and wRC+.
     
  20. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    On April 17, 1869, the Cincinnati Red Stockings played their first game, major league baseball's first professional game.

    The Reds won 24-15.

    They were the first team with all players under contract.
     
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  21. Jack Parkman

    Jack Parkman Endorsed by Fred McGriff
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    Stumbled across this video the other day, was there for this and my God was it a blast. I can't remember if it was the same game or the next one that Big Cat charged the mound vs Dennis Cook




    Big Cat one of those guys who excelled during the steroid era that, imo, doesn't get talked about enough as one of those who are suspected of juicing
     
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  22. Jim Brockmire

    Jim Brockmire I think you're wildly underestimating heroin.
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    New York IslandersManchester UnitedEnglandNational LeaguePittsburgh Pirates

    I like this April 17th gem:

    4-17-1945
    Browns outfielder Pete Gray, playing with one arm, makes his major league debut with one hit in four at-bats in a 7-1 victory over Detroit at Sportsman's Park. The 30 year-old St. Louis outfielder, who lost his right arm in a childhood accident, batted .333 last season as a minor leaguer.
     
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  23. Big Meech

    Big Meech I like turtles
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    Clemson TigersJacksonville Jaguars

    Interesting. Never saw this thread. I will occasionally dabble in buying baseball memorabilia. Nothing crazy, mostly signed balls. Got a new auction catalog recently that had some amazing stuff. Thought this one was pretty cool:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    This was also an amazing item. Here is the description:

    Presented is a multi-signed 1939 Baseball Hall of fame Induction program with a veritable who's who of baseball immortals. The Original owner was present that day June 12, 1939 when the doors of the Baseball Hall of Fame opened and inducted their inaugural class, which included Babe Ruth, Ty Cobb and Walter Johnson. He also was able to obtain the signatures of most of the players in the inaugural Hall of Fame Game, bringing the total eventual Hall of Famers to a whopping 21. The program from the very first Hall of Fame Game was partially scored, likely stopped because he was busy getting the program signed. The First Hall of Included among the (39) scripts are the signatures of Babe Ruth, Walter Johnson, Cy Young, Ty Cobb and Napoleon (Larry) Lajoie. The signatures are spread out over 3 of the 4 pages of the program. To display all of the autographs, the program has been disassembled and mounted to archival board for preservation as well as convenience. The (39) signatories include (21) HOFers Ty Cobb, Eddie Collins, Dizzy Dean, Charlie Gehringer, Hank Greenberg, Lefty Grove, Gabby Hartnett, Billy Herman, Carl Hubbell, Walter Johnson, Bill Klem, Larry Lajoie, Connie Mack, Bill McKechnie, Joe Medwick, Mel Ott, Babe Ruth, Tris Speaker, Bill Terry, Arky Vaughan and Cy Young; and (18) Non-HOFers Johnny Allen, Morris Arnovich, Stan Hack, Frank Hogan, Si Johnson, Art Jorgens, Bill Jurges, Dan MacFayden, Eddie Miller, Terry Moore, Wally Moses, Marvin Owen (signed twice), Cecil Travis, Johnny Vander Meer, Jimmie Wilson and Taft Wright with (1) unidentified. The signatures are all in pencil and are quite legible with the Babe Ruth script among the strongest.

    [​IMG]
     
  24. enjj

    enjj Well-Known Member
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    Pretty cool. Do you have a link to the auction?
     
  25. Big Meech

    Big Meech I like turtles
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    Clemson TigersJacksonville Jaguars

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  26. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    May 15 is the 75th anniversary of the day Joe DiMaggio began his 56 game hitting streak.

    There have been only 55 streaks of 30 or more games in baseball's 147 year history.

    Only 5 other players have hit 40 or more, and Pete Rose's 44 in 1978 is the only 40+ streak since 1922. No one has gone higher than 44.

     
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  27. Fidelio

    Fidelio Well-Known Member
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    Fluky. Ted Williams had a better season.
     
  28. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    Fantastic season for baseball.

    DiMaggio also had a 61 game streak in the minors.

    He got a hit in the All Star game in 1941, which doesn't officially count toward the 56.

    When the 56 streak ended, DiMaggio started a new streak of 16 straight games.

    He walked in the hitless game 57. His streak of reaching base safely in 74 straight games is second all-time to Ted Williams going 84 straight in 1949, when Williams won the AL MVP.
     
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  29. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    Williams was also aided by a fluky BABIP, the highest of his career.
     
  30. Fidelio

    Fidelio Well-Known Member
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    I knew it!
     
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  31. RoyalShocker

    RoyalShocker But I don't wanna be a Nazi
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    To all involved, this is a great thread and I hope it picks back up. While not much of a follower of the game, its history is the most interesting to me of any sport.
     
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  32. Jim Brockmire

    Jim Brockmire I think you're wildly underestimating heroin.
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    Forgot to post this on Friday...

    On May 13, 1952, Pittsburgh Pirates pitching prospect Ron Necciai became the only professional at any level of baseball to strike out 27 batters in a 9 inning game when he accomplished the feat playing for the Bristol Twins of the Class D Appalachian League.

    Two batters put the ball in play, and four batters reached (via BB, a HBP, an E, and a PB on a swinging 3rd strike) a game which also had a four-strikeout inning in the 9th.

    In his next start, Necciai threw a 24 strikeout two-hitter.

    He would go on to win just 1 career MLB game in his only season in the bigs - 1952.
     
  33. Charles DeMar

    Charles DeMar Smug Outlaw
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    SIAP--I thought this was a great article about Ty Cobb and could change how you think about him. And i should note that i've never been a huge fan of him, much in part due to how he was portrayed in that book and movie, which appear to have been based on stories from one guy primarily. Yet, now i'm more interested in reading about him than ever:

    http://imprimis.hillsdale.edu/who-was-ty-cobb-the-history-we-know-thats-wrong/
     
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  34. Tobias

    Tobias dan “the man qb1” jones fan account
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    can not recommend this book enough

     
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  35. TC

    TC Peter, 53, from Toxteth
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    Would like to hear some of people's favorite books they've read on baseball
     
  36. Corky Bucek

    Corky Bucek Placeholder for a Custom Title
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    Auburn TigersLos Angeles LakersLos Angeles RamsAnaheim DucksManchester UnitedLos Angeles Angels of Anaheim

    Moneyball by Michael Lewis
     
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  37. KJROD20

    KJROD20 the ends will justify the means.
    Boston Red SoxBoston CelticsNew York RangersSeton Hall Pirates

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  38. Jim Brockmire

    Jim Brockmire I think you're wildly underestimating heroin.
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    New York IslandersManchester UnitedEnglandNational LeaguePittsburgh Pirates

    I really enjoyed Steinbrenner: The Last Lion of Baseball by Bill Madden. Many people hated Steinbrenner, myself included, but after I read the book I did a complete 180. He was a ruthless dictator in his operation, but he was a first rate human being.
     
  39. Fecta23

    Fecta23 Well-Known Member
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    Jesus. He had a year ( at 1b) where his line was 304 BA 47HRs, 150RBIS and 18 steals. Yeah, that motherfucker was juicing.
     
    #289 Fecta23, May 17, 2016
    Last edited: May 17, 2016
  40. mccar2cm

    mccar2cm Well-Known Member
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    Todd Hundley hit 41 HR as the Mets Catcher that season!

    MVP voting for many of the 80's and 90's season were laughably bad:

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards_1996.shtml
     
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  41. Fecta23

    Fecta23 Well-Known Member
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    Ellis Burks Hitting 340 and went 40/30. Lets bring steroids back, Harper would be hitting 60 Hrs for the next 10 years. Tell me that wouldn't be awesome.
     
  42. kslim

    kslim Guest

    robin yount lenny dykstra and paul molitor should be mentioned more. those guys were awesome.
     
  43. mccar2cm

    mccar2cm Well-Known Member
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    I'm in - is there a petition I can sign?
     
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  44. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    As an undergrad at OSU, I waited tables at a restaurant in a hotel owned by Steinbrenner. The Yankees had their triple AAA team in Columbus at the time. Steinbrenner and his wife were OSU alumni, with his wife's family from Upper Arlington right off of campus where we were located.

    He used the hotel as base of operations for the Yankees when in town.

    Outstanding guy, literally took time to say hello to everyone every time he was in town.

    He kept every semi-famous former Yankee on the payroll and assigned them cushy instructor jobs to meet with the triple AAA guys a few times a year for each former player, basically once a Yankee under Steinbrenner, always a Yankee.
     
  45. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    For a great history, that was written as a contemporary collection of essays, Roger Angell's 1972 The Summer Game.

    It's a time capsule of 1960's baseball, which I view as the first decade of modern baseball (TV, large stadiums, the seeds of the players union, sending the game outside the NE).

    He is one of the contributing interviewees in Ken Burns 1994 Baseball. Burns chose him because of this book.

    An excerpt:

    http://reprints.longform.org/roger-angell-stadium

    http://www.amazon.com/Summer-Game-Bison-Book/dp/0803259514

    [​IMG]
     
  46. DUCKMOUTH

    DUCKMOUTH People don’t you know, don’t you know
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    Orel Hershiser. Fuck it if misspelled it.

    Geat career
     
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  47. spagett

    spagett Got ya, spooked ya
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    Just have to mention this, if it hasn't already been mentioned, baseballreference.com is a fantastic website and you should all visit it.
     
  48. herb.burdette

    herb.burdette Meet me at the corner of 8th and Worthington
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    Ohio State Buckeyes

    Hershiser went from August 30, 1988 to October 4, 1988 without giving up a single run.

    Officially, the regular season record is the 59 he concluded the season with.

    He also pitched 8 scoreless in game 1 of the 1988 NLCS.

    That is the most dominating performance in baseball history. That fact that he did it in the clutch of a pennant race is even more amazing.
     
    #298 herb.burdette, May 17, 2016
    Last edited: May 17, 2016
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  49. mccar2cm

    mccar2cm Well-Known Member
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    His game log from the scoreless streak and the last 9 starts of the regular season is awesome.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/gl.cgi?t=p&n1=hershor01&year=1988

    9 straight CG's, 10 shutout innings to get the record.
     
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  50. War Grundle

    War Grundle Nole Mercy
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    This guy's youtube page is a great time waster if you ever need one. Everything from best catches, throws, hitting for the cycle, triple plays and walk off HRs.

     
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