Bidengeddon: Boring, but radical

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by GoodForAnother, Nov 6, 2020.

  1. BellottiBold

    Donor
    Oregon Ducks

    I mean my expectations are very low but I'm starting to buy the narrative about Bernie being in the inner circle and the amount of influence he has on the agenda setting.
     
  2. Dillingham

    Dillingham Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG

    did you get that from the part where he called getting rid of the filibuster a load of malarkey or?
     
    BellottiBold likes this.
  3. Beeds07

    Beeds07 Bitch, it's Saturday
    Donor
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishSt. Louis CardinalsIndianapolis ColtsSt. Louis Blues

    It’s a three step process

    Step 1: Get your boots
    Step 2: Grab the straps
    Step 3: Pull
     
  4. Hoss Bonaventure

    Donor
    Arkansas RazorbacksSt. Louis CardinalsHouston RocketsDallas CowboysSneakers

    Nope. It’s the workers who need boots with straps so they can suck it up and go work for these poor failing businesses. How dare you besmirch a business owner!
     
    Beeds07 likes this.
  5. theriner69er

    theriner69er Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Cleveland BrownsFlorida State SeminolesDetroit Red Wings

    So the question was: how can the administration incentivize people, particularly in the restaurant industry, to come back to work?
    And the answer was: cooks and waitresses have decided they want different jobs now

    ? His answer was literally: we will do nothing and let the market decide
     
  6. NCHusker

    NCHusker We named our yam Pam. It rhymed.
    Donor TMB OG
    Nebraska CornhuskersChicago CubsDenver NuggetsKansas City ChiefsAvengersUnited States Men's National Soccer TeamUSA BasketballBig 8 ConferenceBig Ten ConferenceNebraska Cornhuskers alt

    So?
     
  7. theriner69er

    theriner69er Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Cleveland BrownsFlorida State SeminolesDetroit Red Wings

    Just pointing that out. "let the market decide" seems to be on par with "let's abuse children" around here, but here's your boy advocating for free market solutions
     
  8. Redav

    Redav One big ocean
    Donor

    He's a centrist democrat not Mao you idiot
     
    Bo Pelinis, popnfresh, bic and 18 others like this.
  9. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor

    people having choices to not work in industries that the people who run the industry at different levels admit is wildly toxic and destructive is a good thing

    but also yes from a reformist structure tilting the balance of power towards labor is good and in line with probably what....80% of this threads politics want as far as outcomes
     
  10. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Missouri TigersSt. Louis CardinalsChicago BullsSt. Louis BluesEverton

     
  11. steamengine

    steamengine I don’t want to press one for English!
    Donor
    LiverpoolHouston Oilers

    I would say it’s problematic that cable news allows newsmax on their platform because of shit like this but Michael Savage has been nationally syndicated on the radio for like 20 years.

     
    BellottiBold likes this.
  12. NCHusker

    NCHusker We named our yam Pam. It rhymed.
    Donor TMB OG
    Nebraska CornhuskersChicago CubsDenver NuggetsKansas City ChiefsAvengersUnited States Men's National Soccer TeamUSA BasketballBig 8 ConferenceBig Ten ConferenceNebraska Cornhuskers alt

    Oh so you're not actually stating your substantive opinion you're just doing your, "nobody else has earnest positions except me" bit

    I did not see that coming
     
  13. theriner69er

    theriner69er Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Cleveland BrownsFlorida State SeminolesDetroit Red Wings

    I actually agree with him. I've just never seen the board agree with the "let the market decide" angle.
     
  14. cutig

    cutig My name is Rod, and I like to party
    Donor
    Clemson TigersNebraska CornhuskersCarolina Panthers

    What would you prefer he said? If that guy wants people to work he obviously needs to pay more.
     
    Daniel Ocean likes this.
  15. steamengine

    steamengine I don’t want to press one for English!
    Donor
    LiverpoolHouston Oilers

  16. Beeds07

    Beeds07 Bitch, it's Saturday
    Donor
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishSt. Louis CardinalsIndianapolis ColtsSt. Louis Blues

    So which tribe is Michael Savage from?
     
    BudKilmer likes this.
  17. NCHusker

    NCHusker We named our yam Pam. It rhymed.
    Donor TMB OG
    Nebraska CornhuskersChicago CubsDenver NuggetsKansas City ChiefsAvengersUnited States Men's National Soccer TeamUSA BasketballBig 8 ConferenceBig Ten ConferenceNebraska Cornhuskers alt

    As Lyrtch said, the board is generally pro labor. President taking a pro labor stance is good even if the methodology isn't exactly what we'd advocate for. Make sense?
     
  18. Tobias

    Tobias dan “the man qb1” jones fan account
    Donor
    North Carolina TarheelsAtlanta BravesCharlotte HornetsNew York GiantsManchester CityNational LeagueBarAndGrill

    apparently this "small business owner" owns like 30 restaurants or something lol
     
  19. theriner69er

    theriner69er Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Cleveland BrownsFlorida State SeminolesDetroit Red Wings

    It makes sense that the board would be all for "let the market decide" when it works in their favor, and think "let the market decide" is an evil capitalistic rallying cry designed to fuck people over and kill babies (probably) when it doesn't, yes. Sorry, I forgot where I was.
     
  20. Redav

    Redav One big ocean
    Donor

  21. CaneKnight

    CaneKnight FSU Private Board's Fav Poster
    Donor

    Nancy Mace is far more problematic and hotter imo
     
    Deep dirt likes this.
  22. NCHusker

    NCHusker We named our yam Pam. It rhymed.
    Donor TMB OG
    Nebraska CornhuskersChicago CubsDenver NuggetsKansas City ChiefsAvengersUnited States Men's National Soccer TeamUSA BasketballBig 8 ConferenceBig Ten ConferenceNebraska Cornhuskers alt

    I honestly thought this was going to maybe turn out to be a productive riner convo
     
  23. Redav

    Redav One big ocean
    Donor

    Even when my gotcha doesn't work I'm still going to shoe horn that shit in
     
  24. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor

    if we ignore the context in which this is being said you're all hypocrites and bad and i'm the smart one gottem
     
  25. NCHusker

    NCHusker We named our yam Pam. It rhymed.
    Donor TMB OG
    Nebraska CornhuskersChicago CubsDenver NuggetsKansas City ChiefsAvengersUnited States Men's National Soccer TeamUSA BasketballBig 8 ConferenceBig Ten ConferenceNebraska Cornhuskers alt

    If I support ending homelessness by abolishing private property I'm a hypocrite if I also support homeless shelters
     
  26. Beeds07

    Beeds07 Bitch, it's Saturday
    Donor
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishSt. Louis CardinalsIndianapolis ColtsSt. Louis Blues

    [​IMG]
     
  27. NCHusker

    NCHusker We named our yam Pam. It rhymed.
    Donor TMB OG
    Nebraska CornhuskersChicago CubsDenver NuggetsKansas City ChiefsAvengersUnited States Men's National Soccer TeamUSA BasketballBig 8 ConferenceBig Ten ConferenceNebraska Cornhuskers alt

    I give people the benefit of the doubt to a fault
     
  28. CaneKnight

    CaneKnight FSU Private Board's Fav Poster
    Donor

    Everyone loves capitalism until it negatively affects them.
     
  29. Tobias

    Tobias dan “the man qb1” jones fan account
    Donor
    North Carolina TarheelsAtlanta BravesCharlotte HornetsNew York GiantsManchester CityNational LeagueBarAndGrill

    damn that was stupid as hell of you lol
     
  30. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    Alabama Crimson TideNew York YankeesJacksonville JaguarsSneakers

    It's insane that companies like DirectTV allow it on their lineup.
     
  31. AbeFroman

    AbeFroman You touch me, I yell RAT!

    Like clockwork.
     
    Beeds07 likes this.
  32. theriner69er

    theriner69er Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Cleveland BrownsFlorida State SeminolesDetroit Red Wings

    Yea, it's more of an ends justify the means argument, isn't it? We hate this oppressive "free market" bullshit.
    Wait, it benefits us in this case? Well yay free market!
     
  33. timo

    timo a joker in the pack
    Donor
    Penn State Nittany LionsPittsburgh SteelersPittsburgh PenguinsTottenham HotspurPittsburgh Pirates

    alright, riner, I'll bite. What are you suggesting the POTUS do to help out this *checks notes* rich guy who owns 30 restaurants who can't find people too down on their luck to work for his pittance wages?
     
  34. AbeFroman

    AbeFroman You touch me, I yell RAT!

  35. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor

    yes neoliberals promoting austerity by signaling fealty to "free markets" is bad

    reformed neoliberals/more pre-neoliberal minded politicians using that same framing for supporting labor is good politics
     
  36. NCHusker

    NCHusker We named our yam Pam. It rhymed.
    Donor TMB OG
    Nebraska CornhuskersChicago CubsDenver NuggetsKansas City ChiefsAvengersUnited States Men's National Soccer TeamUSA BasketballBig 8 ConferenceBig Ten ConferenceNebraska Cornhuskers alt

    I don't expect Joe Biden to abolish capitalism so it's okay for me to be happy he's doing something within the realm of possibility that helps the working class

    This isn't even remotely complicated. I feel like a 2nd grader would understand this concept
     
  37. theriner69er

    theriner69er Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Cleveland BrownsFlorida State SeminolesDetroit Red Wings

    Again, I agree with what he's saying. Let the market decide. If other employers can out-bid this restaurant owner for employees, then so be it.

    What I didn't understand is all the Marxists on this board being in favor of a "let the market decide!" solution. But, as it's been explained, if the end result is pro-labor, the means by which we get there is not particularly relevant. Let the market decide, let government decide, whatever.
     
  38. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor

    you seem to be missing that the labor power tilt right now is because of government, just like the previous kowtowing to capital was a by product of government, where the "free market" framing was just telling the people the government wasn't aiding to eat shit

    its a completely opposite dynamic but as you usually do you try to strip the context away to do some galaxy brain hypocrite policing
     
  39. NCHusker

    NCHusker We named our yam Pam. It rhymed.
    Donor TMB OG
    Nebraska CornhuskersChicago CubsDenver NuggetsKansas City ChiefsAvengersUnited States Men's National Soccer TeamUSA BasketballBig 8 ConferenceBig Ten ConferenceNebraska Cornhuskers alt

    This is not what has been said but you're determined to see this boogeyman everywhere you look so I'm not surprised that's how you understood it

    People aren't anti-free market as like a fundamental principle. People are anti-free market because it fundamentally exploits the working class. The exploitation of the working class is the issue. Things that lead to less exploitation of the working class are good, even if we're still stuck in a capitalist dystopia.
     
  40. Illinihockey

    Illinihockey Well-Known Member
    Chicago CubsChicago BullsChicago BearsChicago BlackhawksIllinois Fightin' IlliniLiverpool

    people are happy because it helps people. They aren’t cheering the mechanism they are cheering the result
     
  41. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor

    feel like we need a class on what reformist minded left liberals are, like SocDem style

    as that's where most this board is or is headed, vs the hurrr marxists thing
     
    steamengine and IV like this.
  42. Illinihockey

    Illinihockey Well-Known Member
    Chicago CubsChicago BullsChicago BearsChicago BlackhawksIllinois Fightin' IlliniLiverpool

    Can’t believe Joe didn’t say sir, hopefully the workers are going to rise up and throw off their yoke and take your business for the people
     
  43. theriner69er

    theriner69er Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Cleveland BrownsFlorida State SeminolesDetroit Red Wings

    Isn't the "methodology" you are referencing here the "let the market decide" approach? I read this as: generally we wouldn't want the market to decide, because it would exploit labor. But because in this particular case the market is deciding in favor of labor, we are all for it.

    So we are against letting the market decide, and we've demonized that exact phrase, ad nauseum. But now that it works in our favor, we want the market to decide.
     
  44. theriner69er

    theriner69er Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Cleveland BrownsFlorida State SeminolesDetroit Red Wings

    Right. The ends justifies the means. I get it, I understand. The hypocrisy is in demonizing the means, until it benefits your position.
     
  45. AptosDuck

    AptosDuck Pedantic Hausfrau
    Donor
    California Golden Bears

    The intentional obtuseness just has to be exhausting
     
  46. NCHusker

    NCHusker We named our yam Pam. It rhymed.
    Donor TMB OG
    Nebraska CornhuskersChicago CubsDenver NuggetsKansas City ChiefsAvengersUnited States Men's National Soccer TeamUSA BasketballBig 8 ConferenceBig Ten ConferenceNebraska Cornhuskers alt

    The fundamental problem with letting the market decide is the exploitation of labor. Biden took a stance that will result in less exploitation of labor. Therefore reducing the fundamental harm done by a market approach. It is positive because it reduces the harm of the thing. That's not us supporting the thing. You are so fucking dense
     
  47. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor

    fwiw i'm cheering the mechanism, an expansion of the safety net/dropping of work reqs for CTC/on and on leading to a labor advantage followed by the economic version of "thoughts and prayers" rhetoric

    im in
     
    steamengine, AbeFroman and NCHusker like this.
  48. timo

    timo a joker in the pack
    Donor
    Penn State Nittany LionsPittsburgh SteelersPittsburgh PenguinsTottenham HotspurPittsburgh Pirates

  49. Illinihockey

    Illinihockey Well-Known Member
    Chicago CubsChicago BullsChicago BearsChicago BlackhawksIllinois Fightin' IlliniLiverpool

    are people on here saying all markets are bad? Seems like you’ve created a strawman here
     
    MORBO! likes this.
  50. Illinihockey

    Illinihockey Well-Known Member
    Chicago CubsChicago BullsChicago BearsChicago BlackhawksIllinois Fightin' IlliniLiverpool

    also the lack of actual markets. Most markets aren’t open and free which ends in a lot of bad results.
     
    AbeFroman and NCHusker like this.