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Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by TrustyPatches, Mar 15, 2020.
Thanks for this.
Doubt this is new news or anything, but the Dr. at my vaccine trial appt. (Pfizer) said they know the vaccine is well tolerated, and produces antibodies. The only question now is if those antibodies prevent infection, and how long they last. He said they will probably have an answer to the first question in about 4-6 months. Emergency authorization for healthcare workers and such may come in Nov.
All of the big 3 vaccine makers (Pfizer, Moderna, AstraZeneca) have shown results that they produce antibodies and I believe all 3 have shown that there is a decent amount of antibodies even 3 months post inoculation. I know for Moderna this was a huge positive sign even in older patients. Pfizer and Moderna should hopefully have some efficacy results before the end of the year.
Yea what sucks is they can prove safety a lot sooner than they can prove efficacy. They need enough placebo people to get infected.
Haven’t been reading as much in the last 3 weeks being out with Covid myself, anyone have any good recent mask articles? I have a huge list of older studies but didn’t know if anything came out recently.
So everything I'm seeing now is these vaccines won't prevent spread of the virus but will lessen symptoms. Did we know that? Is the goal to give this to at risk people and then say fuck it and let everyone else get sick?
Not true. It’s not like these vaccines are gonna work differently than literally every other vaccine in existence.
Idk what you replied to but it sounds stupid
The idea that vaccines won’t stop the spread but will lessen symptoms.
Ah. Nothing is almost ever black and white. Probably going to be shades of grey on both metrics.
Dr Anthony Fauci has cautioned that early COVID-19 vaccines will be focused on preventing symptoms of the virus, not blocking it altogether.
Fauci, the nation's leading expert on infectious diseases, made the point on Monday as at least four vaccine candidates near the end of clinical trials and the US reported a record number of new cases in the last week.
While the end goal of the vaccines will be to eradicate the virus, Fauci noted that developers are aiming for a simpler goal in the first round of jabs.
'The primary thing you want to do is that if people get infected, prevent them from getting sick, and if you prevent them from getting sick, you will ultimately prevent them from getting seriously ill,' Fauci said at Yahoo Finance's All Markets Summit.
'If the vaccine also allows you to prevent initial infection, that would be great. [But] what I would settle for, and all of my colleagues would settle for, is the primary endpoint to prevent clinically recognizable disease.'
Fauci's comments put a damper on America's hopes that forthcoming vaccines will bring the pandemic to its knees, highlighting the ongoing importance of other infection prevention methods like masks and social distancing.
Sure, I think he’s just setting expectations. The goal of vaccination is to prevent initial infections, but even with influenza we know elders who get the vaccine usually have milder cases and less morbidity/complications than Those who don’t get it.
Good podcast from Planet Money on kids and covid
1) scary how poor government is at collecting data
2) this random mom blogger started a cool project to help
There was a super huge tweet thread posted by some PhD that was shared here where a lot of the vaccines, thus far, have shown that they may prevent illness in the lungs but not fully in the upper respiratory tract and he suggested that may still allow spread. I'm assuming the flu vaccine is the same and that would still be hugely beneficial.
Wouldn’t vaccines also theoretically reduce the contagious time frame for recipients?
Haven’t seen it. So apologies to Illinihockey if I’m way off on my responses. I know the goal is still to reduce transmission completely, but early vaccines are not going to be MMR-tier effective.
correct. i think what we don't know here is impact on transmission of a vaccine. it's likely to lessen symptoms.
pperc Does this mean Pfizer thinks they'll have enough efficacy data to show if their vaccine is somewhat effective? Despite how fast they're working I'd be shocked if any of these manufacturers got enough data before close to the end of the yar.
no it says they'll get safety data and then apply for EUA (frontline workers could get it, for example). I think full efficacy data may take time as you say. He tweeted this out as there has been a lot of chatter yesterday and today that this data is delayed and we should have already had it.
Okay, I was under the impression that EUA required at least some efficacy data but I guess that's not correct.
If you want to get technical, read this
Awesome, thank you. I found this exact quote which means Moderna is probably pretty close to where they could apply for EUA based on having safety data.
I just got accepted into the Novavax vaccine trial but it doesn't start for another couple weeks yet. For those that are following these things closely....should I get my affairs in order or how's this companies vaccine looked so far?
you'll be fine... probably.
This is the confidence I come here for!
Is it Phase 1/2 or Phase 3?
You're more likely to die of something else during the trial
Most recent news...
You'll be fine, Phase 1/2 is mostly to evaluate safety. Phase 3 can catch possible rare side-effects given how many people participate, but it's mostly to see if you're protected.
You’ve had a good run anyways
We’ve discussed how shady that company is tho... at least the ceo is.
You mean Moderna?
If a couple of these vaccines get EUA by Thanksgiving, when could we see them start being distributed on a wider scale? Christmas? Middle of January?
For front line workers? Maybe.
If everything goes well, probably April for the general population.
Mentally, I’m preparing for Labor Day before the vaccine will be wide-spread enough to feel comfortable.
It would be nice if most of the older people could get vaccinated in the first couple of months in 2021. My 74 year old MIL had to move in with us because of how poorly she was doing when the assisted living facility she was in (in California) locked down, she's getting a lot worse with dementia that is likely Alzheimer's. It would be a huge weight off our shoulders if she could be one of the first of the general public to get vaccinated. I'm probably at one of the worst points in feeling depressed since I was a teenager right now, I have to sleep in the office room because my wife needs to sleep with her mother as she'll get up and start wandering or soil herself in the middle of the night.
brutal, im sorry.
The AstraZeneca vaccine is the best shot at a vaccine working in the elderly, IMO
Thinking front line workers at 65+
Aplologies if you've already addressed this, but do you foresee any kind of concerted effort to stack multiple vaccines together and give them to folks like the elderly who may not derive as much benefit from a single vaccine as younger people? Given that these different vaccines use different pathways, is it a good idea to offer them as a cocktail or sequentially to the elderly or the rest of the population in order to boost efficacy?
that sort of clinical development would be an absolute nightmare, so in short, no way
our plan is getting small supply of vaccines sometime between thanksgiving and christmas. First batch is allocated for ICU staff, ED staff, and LTC staff. Then next batches would go to patients 65+ and immunosuppressed/high risk. Then rest of employees. Then rest of patients. We don't expect much for volume of vaccinations until Spring/Summer or later.
Why would you do this? Highly unlikely to be any data to support even immunogenicity in these patient populations for Pfizer / Moderna vaccines.
That was our ethics board decision. I’m sure if they haven’t/won’t be approved for those populations then we won’t give. Again, just the plan on paper right now.
Why / what does that mean?
Vaccines tend to not work very well in the elderly
Man that sucks hang in there.