Fulham - Rodrigo’s On Fire

Discussion in 'Soccer Board' started by BayouMafia, May 7, 2010.

  1. PJP3

    PJP3 Well-Known Member
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    ugh, what was Aina doing not going after that?
     
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  2. PJP3

    PJP3 Well-Known Member
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    What? how the fuck was that offside? I mean, I'll take it, but holy VAR
     
  3. BayouMafia

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    I hate that in general, but whew
     
  4. TheFreak55

    TheFreak55 He should keep his mouth firmly shut
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    BayouMafia whats the name of the place you’re at
     
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  5. BayouMafia

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    Crown and Anchor
     
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  6. mc415

    mc415 Well-Known Member
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    That was painful
     
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  7. PJP3

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    welp, waking up to see the newcastle score kinda seals it. Hopefully all the online bitching between the we can still stay up and the we are relegated guys can ease up. Is it just me, but are online Fulham fans some of the most grating people to listen to? Everything is an argument an apparently you know everything if you have supported the club longer.
     
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  8. Iron Mickey

    Iron Mickey a guy who posted here like five years ago hates me
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    Online football is awful in general imo. Just a baffling mix of pedantry and whining.
     
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  9. Fran Tarkenton

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    how many years does Fulham stay down this go around
     
  10. Andy Reocho

    Andy Reocho Please don't get lost in the sauce
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    I don't see why they can't bounce right back, I think they can maintain a lot of the squad, no?
     
  11. PJP3

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    Our defense will take a massive hit. Anderson and Areola were arguably our most important players this year, them gone along with at least lookman, Aina, Anguissa and Mitro and we are downgrading many positions. A backline of Kongolo, Aradibayo, Tete and Robinson with Rodak isn't bad if we can keep all of them, but until we sign some decent players our midfield is Reed, Cairney, and ? we have no forwards worth a shit. Cav, BDR, and (shudder) Kamara. Maybe this gets some of the youth guys like Jasper or Carvalho to get a look. I just don't see a bounce right back. We got lucky to get into the playoff and get up last season. I would like to see a few seasons of rebuild with younger players and have a more stable club next time we push to go up.
     
  12. Fran Tarkenton

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  13. BayouMafia

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    To me it's more a matter of whether bouncing right back is the best thing for the long term. Take this year as an example: we went up thanks to some luck in the playoff, and versus last year we have new, better players at nearly every position and have been lucky with injuries and we still have come a player or two short of staying up. That's with every transfer/loan being a win. If we have to do the same thing again in a year or two it's doubtful that we are as successful with transfers as we were this year (look at our last season in the PL where our transfer hit rate was a disaster).

    Much better to spend a few years building a core of players who can make the transition than rely on bringing in a completely different squad after promotion.
     
  14. BayouMafia

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    pretty much this
     
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  15. BayouMafia

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    Unbelievable. If it were 3 minutes of extra time they’d have scored in the 93rd. Just can’t close out
     
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  16. mc415

    mc415 Well-Known Member
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    That was painful
     
  17. construxboy

    construxboy xenForo is the new TMB
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    Rooting for you guys to stay up.
     
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  18. BayouMafia

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    My guess for starting XI in the Championship next year, assuming we don’t sell guys like Tosin and that Anguissa is either loaned or sold:

    Mitro
    Cavaleiro Carvalho BDR
    Cairney Reed
    Robinson Tosin Kongolo Tete
    Rodak

    That’s a team that should be favored to win promotion, but of course is still nowhere near PL quality if they do go right back up
     
  19. PJP3

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    I like that team but I think Mitro will leave and theres no way Kongolo stays healthy so we’ll need another capable cb.
     
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  20. BayouMafia

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    I posed that question to Peter Rutzler and he agreed about Mitro leaving

    1B00CD04-F555-432D-823A-CD49FA88CD67.jpeg
     
  21. Fran Tarkenton

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    Tosin will stay in PL if I am guessing

    Cairney needs to gtfo. Find someone young that can navigate, then stay with, the team through promotion.
     
  22. Fran Tarkenton

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    On other hand, Mitro in championship I have no problem with as Striker is one of those spots you can (and need to) improve after promotion.

    I just doubt Tony is going to learn all the right lessons on his 3rd attempt at getting the roster construction right.
     
  23. BayouMafia

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    with relegation all but assured let's see if these guys can string some goals together

    4-2-3-1 looks like
     
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  24. BayouMafia

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    offside anyway, but Cav just stumbling over that ball in the box is exactly why we're going down. This team has no competence whatsoever in the opponent's box
     
  25. BayouMafia

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    on a positive note I feel like that shot of Parker nervously chugging on a water bottle is very meme-able
     
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  26. Fran Tarkenton

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  27. PJP3

    PJP3 Well-Known Member
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    Seems like a rinse and repeat situation. Hard to get excited about. I want to see some youth and new blood come in even if it involves staying in the championship for a bit. If we just trot out mainly the same side from two years ago I will be disappointed.
     
  28. BayouMafia

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    Next years team will be a better team than we fielded last year, and guys like Tosin, Robinson, and Tete did ok in the PL so if we go right back up we're not going to need to overhaul that has been required in previous years. We need to add a couple of attackers who can make the PL transition if we do go up rather than gaining promotion and then paying millions for some fill-ins.
     
  29. BayouMafia

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    I'm going to miss Peter next year. Excellent piece in The Athletic:



    For Fulham, it is an all too familiar sinking feeling. Their second relegation from the top flight in four years was confirmed following defeat to Burnley. It is their third under owner Shahid Khan, and a second in the five years since director of football operations and vice-chairman, Tony Khan, Shahid’s son, took on a more active role at the club.

    The top-flight continuity they once knew under Mohamed Al-Fayed, who oversaw 13 successive seasons in the Premier League, feels like the distant past. Fulham are trapped in an oscillating motion between boom and bust, of extreme highs and lows.

    This season started with the positive intention of learning from the mistakes of 2018-19, when a £100 million outlay proved too much too quickly and the team tumbled straight back down. This time has not been so bruising, although the anguish feels no less severe. There have been late defeats, points dropped from winning positions and missed opportunities. In April, Fulham had three chances to escape the bottom three for the first time since December. They passed them up, and others stole a march.

    “Learning lessons” was the mantra that followed 2019 and that has taken place, to an extent. The club placed trust in Scott Parker for the duration of the campaign, avoiding a managerial carousel that proved toxic two years ago. They also avoided extensive transfer investment, which cast a long shadow financially two years ago.

    In part forced by COVID-19 and financial fair play restrictions, the club turned to the loan market with mostly success. The likes of Joachim Andersen, Ademola Lookman and Alphonse Areola have all excelled. Shrewd acquisitions, like Tosin Adarabioyo, Antonee Robinson and Kenny Tete, have also lifted the team.

    This was always going to be a tough season as Fulham had the tightest turnaround in top-flight history, five weeks between play-off success and the first day of the new campaign.

    Fulham simply lacked a cutting edge and a bit of good fortune, but there were more fundamental flaws again and the outcome has been the same. Delayed recruitment, hindered in part by the pandemic but an increasingly familiar pattern, left the team ill-equipped for the opening matches. Whereas defence was an issue in 2018-19, attack proved their downfall this time.

    The reality upon returning to the Championship is familiar. With loanees departing, Fulham’s squad will need surgery once again. The old-guard core, who secured promotion and were then cast aside, will need to be rehabilitated or moved on. There is discontent too among supporters, aimed mainly at Tony Khan. He has overseen a second relegation while appearing to work in his Fulham roles, which mainly centre on recruitment but include the title of general manager alongside sporting director, on a part-time basis due to commitments in wrestling and the NFL.

    Fulham appear to have the resources and experience to secure another promotion but have lacked the know-how to stabilise in the top flight. They are stuck on a “rollercoaster”, as Parker put it, rather than developing or growing along a discernible pathway. What happens in the coming weeks, then, is critical to understanding whether they will revert to type, and continue their yo-yo cycle, or whether they will try something different.

    After confirmation of relegation, The Athletic understands that:

    • Fulham want Parker to stay — he has said he remains “committed” but it appears he may wait for “pivotal and crucial” discussions in the summer
    • Their long-term target remains to be a stable top-flight club
    • The Riverside Stand development, delayed until 2022 due to the pandemic, will not be further impacted
    • It is understood there is no need to make redundancies and all senior players have wage-reduction clauses
    • Fulham hope to fill the position of director of scouting, a replacement for former assistant director of football operations Javier Pereira, before the new season. It is seen as an integral position
    • Sources close to Aleksandar Mitrovic say that, for now, it is unlikely he will stay while Parker is in charge
    • Academy talents Sylvester Jasper, Tyrese Francois, Fabio Carvalho, George Wickens, Luca Ashby-Hammond and Jerome Opoku are all likely to be involved during pre-season. It is expected that breakthrough talent Carvalho will sign a long-term contract.
    What is the financial impact of relegation?
    Fulham expect a drop in revenue of around £55 million. However, it is understood that there will not be a need for staff redundancies, as previous relegation costs were cut in that way and were not majorly increased thereafter. It is also understood that the club are confident that wage-reduction clauses in player contracts, and the departure of loan players, will cover the drop in revenue.

    The club confirmed to the Fulham Supporters’ Trust this year that the Riverside Stand development will now be unveiled in 2022, due to construction delays caused by the pandemic, but there are no further delays envisioned.

    Fulham do not need to sell players but their activity in the transfer market is likely to be impacted by financial fair play (FFP) restrictions. Fulham announced a loss of £45.2 million in March for the 2019-20 season, which is up considerably from the £20.2 million (minus deductible assets permitted under FFP regulations) that followed 2018-19. The Championship has tighter FFP restrictions than the Premier League, only permitting losses below £13 million per season compared to £35 million in the top flight.

    FFP restrictions were relaxed in the Premier League and the EFL due to the pandemic, with clubs allowed to deduct “COVID-19 related impacts”. From gate receipts alone, for example, Fulham will have lost around £10 million this season, based on comparable 2018-19 accounts.

    Next season, however, Fulham sources expect Championship FFP restrictions to have some bite. The 2020-21 season saw a far more prudent approach to the transfer market, with a net outlay of around £30 million. With television broadcast revenue coming in, that should put the club in a better FFP position over a three-year period. After 2020-21, Fulham would be permitted losses of £83 million (two Premier League limits of £35 million losses added to one Championship campaign of £13 million). That drops again to £61 million at the end of the next season, subject to pandemic rule changes.

    Despite expected FFP limits, Fulham’s hierarchy are believed to feel they recruited a lot of the players already at the club with both divisions in mind.

    How will they seek to break their yo-yo cycle?
    There is a hope that the cycle will not end immediately, of course — Fulham are bidding for another immediate return. Longer-term, Fulham intend to become an established top-flight club.

    Tony Khan has officially been the off-field figurehead at Fulham below his father for the past four years. He has had some on-pitch success during his tenure, mainly during the two promotion campaigns.

    But the club have also had three head coaches of varying stylistic schools under Tony Khan — Slavisa Jokanovic, Claudio Ranieri and Parker — and signed 46 players. Of those, they are only known to have made a profit on two players not brought through the academy — Sone Aluko and Jozabed.

    Khan’s main focus is recruitment and this season, his work in the transfer market has been praised. Arrivals such as Tosin, Robinson and Tete point to a redirection towards players improving for sell-on value and their arrival sums of £1.5 million, £1.9 million and £3 million respectively are rightly lauded. There are exceptions, such as Terence Kongolo (£4 million rising to £7 million), whose season has been heavily affected by injury. The loan arrivals have, mostly, been seen as positive improvements, although Ruben Loftus-Cheek has not made the impact hoped.

    [​IMG]

    Andersen has been excellent since arriving on loan from Lyon (Photo by Chloe Knott – Danehouse/Getty Images)
    Relegation will mean squad turnover once again and that has seen Khan draw fierce criticism from supporters. He has admitted mistakes concerning the club’s £100 million outlay in 2018-19, which hampered Fulham this year by way of Financial Fair Play restrictions, but there is a continued trend of recruitment coming late in the window. This year, that delay undoubtedly played a part in a slow start.

    Concern also lies in how he combines his role with other commitments. He has been running All-Elite Wrestling in the United States since 2019, and is senior vice-president of football and technology at the Jacksonville Jaguars in the NFL. This means he can only be operating part-time at Fulham. So far, this juggling of roles has not been an approach that has enabled the club to re-establish themselves at the top level.

    Fulham have not replaced Pereira, meaning only chief scout Brian Talbot — who works from Motspur Park but spends most of his time travelling — as the only lead recruitment figure on the ground full-time since September. They have been eager to change that. As revealed by The Athletic last week, the search for Pereira’s replacement will be a new position, the director of scouting. This role will take on the responsibilities of Pereira, who was tasked with ensuring the academy, the senior squad and recruitment were in alignment. It is understood Fulham see this role as crucial to the club’s structure and want this position filled quickly.

    The Athletic understands the director of scouting position will sit next to the other senior positions within the hierarchy, with chief executive Alistair Mackintosh focused on finance, Parker on coaching and Tony Khan on the statistical and analytical side to recruitment. Khan will retain a veto.

    Judging from Parker’s recent comments, structure is an important topic for discussion. He said: “It is something we will go over and see where things can improve or whether they need to improve. I have my views. I will express them to the club at the end of the season. We’ll put our views across and see where we get to.”

    On the director of scouting position, he said: “There’s a difference between filling positions and putting in place a structure for those positions that works smoothly. I have not been consulted regarding that position. If the club feel it is important, in terms of helping us get better and doing our business and identifying players in a better way, then perfect.”

    At present, it is not thought that the new director of scouting position will amount to a club restructure.

    What of the squad?
    “This squad won’t be the squad next year,” Parker said before Fulham’s trip to Chelsea at the start of the month. “Whatever league we’re in, how we’ve gone about our businesses means this squad will not be this squad. The challenge is going to be to rebuild it.”

    Fulham’s squad was always going to need surgery. Indeed, it is understood that Fulham expect all of their loan players to depart.

    With relegation, there are further matters to consider. There are 13 players aged 28 or older on the club’s books, only two of whom will see their contracts expire by the end of next season. Some sources have intimated that the team will need to undergo a process of phasing out their old guard and rebuilding. That will not be a straightforward task.

    There is a confidence that those players who achieved promotion in 2019-20 can help the club do so again. The majority of the starting XI who beat Brentford at Wembley are expected to play a key part in the Championship again, with Harrison Reed, Bobby De Cordova-Reid, Tom Cairney, Marek Rodak, Joe Bryan, Michael Hector, Aboubakar Kamara, Neeskens Kebano and Josh Onomah all on the books.

    Onomah is thought to be in line for an important role next season, having sat out for much of this campaign due to a hip injury. Kebano, meanwhile, will return to Fulham after a successful loan spell at Middlesbrough, and it is thought Steven Sessegnon, who will be 21 at the start of next season, could be involved next year.

    Combined with the first makings of a new younger influx, including Robinson, Tosin, Tete and Kongolo, Fulham have a starting point for next season. Tete is a player who could attract interest, but it is hoped his happiness at the club will encourage him to stay. There is no appetite to sell players but it’s understood that if an offer makes good business sense, it will be considered. Looking at the squad on paper, Fulham will need to invest in attacking areas.

    The challenge for the head coach will be to rehabilitate those players who have spent much of the season on the sidelines, including those out on loan.

    Queens Park Rangers manager Mark Warburton has publicly expressed his desire to keep Stefan Johansen, who has excelled since joining his January loan move. Considering he was omitted from Fulham’s Premier League squad, an exit is conceivable. Sources close to Jean Michael Seri say it will be difficult for him to stay at Fulham, but it is also unlikely that he will join Bordeaux permanently. Andre-Frank Zambo Anguissa, one of the highest earners, is likely to depart and will have no shortage of suitors.

    It is possible that Fulham will need to do without their Championship top scorer from 2019-20, too. Sources close to Mitrovic have indicated he is unlikely to stay on should Parker remain in charge. Mitrovic has played only an intermittent role this season, despite the team’s struggle for goals. That has been a coaching decision. “I have to make decisions that I feel are best for the team and the dynamic of the team against certain opposition,” Parker said after the defeat by Chelsea.

    [​IMG]

    Mitrovic has not been happy at his bit-part role this season. Photo: Chloe Knott/Danehouse/Getty Images)
    Of the loanees, Mario Lemina had an obligation to buy worth £7 million in his loan deal from Southampton but this will not be automatically activated after relegation.

    He has attracted mid-table Premier League interest. Areola is another who is a cut above the Championship, as is Lookman, who could well be given a fresh start under new RB Leipzig boss Jesse Marsch. Torino are reportedly still eager to sell Ola Aina for the same price as Fulham’s loan-to-buy clause (around £11 million) and Josh Maja has an option-to-buy clause worth £9 million.

    Andersen is another who will be too good for the second tier. Those close to the defender speak of his great relationship with Parker and his enjoyment at Fulham, and there was a sense he would consider staying. However, that is not a possibility following relegation and there are big clubs monitoring him, including Tottenham Hotspur. Lyon are set to part ways with Rudi Garcia, potentially opening the door to reintegration in France, but his focus for the summer is said to be solely on the European Championship with Denmark.

    Fulham are hopeful that relegation may, at least, offer opportunities to blood further talent from their academy.

    How will the academy be affected by relegation?
    Fulham have a successful category one academy. Players such as Ryan Sessegnon, Harvey Elliott, Patrick Roberts, and Moussa Dembele have all come through the ranks in recent years and more talent looks to be on the way. Fulham’s under-18s are on course to retain their Premier League South title. They have scored 75 goals in 23 matches, and if they beat Chelsea on Saturday, they will be crowned champions.

    The greater challenge, though, is pushing talent into the first team. “It (their league campaign) is a fantastic achievement,” said Parker. “But I’m sure (under-18s manager) Steve Wigley and (academy director) Huw Jennings will say that the academy will only ever be judged on what comes through to the first team.”

    That has not always been easy in recent years. Fulham’s up-and-down existence is felt to make it difficult for head coaches to blood young players. That is not to say it does not happen — playmaker Carvalho made his Premier League debut against Chelsea in May and Rodak excelled in goal in the Championship.

    The Championship offers a different type of football — more attritional, more turnovers in possession. That can make it tougher for flair players to have an impact. However, dropping down a division lowers the gap to senior football for Fulham’s best young players, who hope they may now get their chance.

    It is understood that winger Jasper, midfielder Francois, defender Opoku and goalkeepers Ashby-Hammond and Wickens are all likely to be involved in pre-season, along with Carvalho. All have been around the first-team set-up in the past and could make the step up.

    Jasper is felt to have outgrown the under-23s already and, should he not be seen as part of first-team plans, is likely to be in line for a loan move. Opoku has performed well at Plymouth and the League One club are thought to be keen to retain him, but he has also attracted interest from the Championship. As a left-sided defender, that makes him an asset, although Fulham do already have Tim Ream, Maxime Le Marchand and Kongolo on the books.

    Francois’s season has been disrupted by injury and his contract is said to expire this season, but it is thought likely Fulham will activate a one-year extension. The goalkeepers’ involvement will likely depend on first-team positions, with Marcus Bettinelli set to return from Middlesbrough. Fulham have a fantastic record for bringing through goalkeepers, but finding minutes in a competitive position is the priority.

    Carvalho has one year left on his contract and has been monitored by Benfica and Juventus, but it is understood that he is in line to sign a new long-term deal. It is hoped that he will play an important role next season, hopefully following the pathway taken by Ryan Sessegnon. His debut against Chelsea shows Parker has been impressed by the attacking midfielder.

    The academy will not be affected financially by relegation. Their funding from the ownership is separated, ensuring continuity regardless of what happens with the first team.

    One outstanding concern surrounds Parker’s future. A turnover of managers makes it difficult for players to gain the trust of a first-team coach, and whether Parker stays or goes could have a bearing on the development of the latest crop of youngsters…

    So what about Parker?
    Parker has two years remaining on his contract. A three-year deal was signed after securing promotion and although he achieved that target, he has fallen short this year. As head coach, he deserves his share of the blame and has drawn criticism from fans for his sometimes conservative tactical approach, particularly in key games.

    There are mitigating circumstances and he has received plaudits for the style of play he has tried to implement. As a result, Parker’s job is not under threat — Fulham are expecting the 40-year-old to lead them in the Championship.

    Parker, for his part, has not confirmed his ambitions for next season. His recent comments surrounding the need for a squad rebuild, the structure and the director of scouting position do not suggest a straightforward decision is coming though. After the defeat by Burnley, he said the club need to make “pivotal and crucial” decisions to end the club’s promotion-relegation rollercoaster. He would not be drawn further on what that would entail but said he expected those topics to broached in a club review.

    “The club needs to make big decisions,” he said. “We’ve had a relegation, a promotion and a relegation. The rollercoaster of that and the highs and lows is not something you want. As a club we need to work out where we want to go.”

    Parker has attracted interest this season from other clubs, including links to Tottenham, where he made his first steps into management alongside the majority of his coaching team. Parker has dismissed those rumours. There are long-time admirers in the form of Bournemouth too, where manager Jonathan Woodgate’s contract will expire in the summer.

    There have been moments of frustration from Parker: he publicly rebuked Tony Khan for apologising for the team’s performance on Twitter after defeat by Aston Villa in September, and similarly described Khan’s Twitter comments about FFP and failing to sign striker Ivan Toney as “not helpful” in February. “I want people to perceive us as a club that is world-class in everything we do,” Parker said at the time. “There are parts of that I can’t control.”

    But he has praised the hierarchy for their support as well. “My relationship with Tony is amazing, it is totally fine,” he said in October. “In terms of Tony and Mr (Shahid) Khan, they have been very supportive of everything that I’ve done in my position since I’ve been here.”

    On his future, Parker said after the Burnley defeat: “It’s not a conversation for tonight. We’ve got three games left. After that, the discussion we have is what we need to do to improve. That will speak for itself.”
     
  30. BayouMafia

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    Things are going swimmingly

     
  31. PJP3

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    Well there’s something positive! Start Carvalho next year.
     
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  32. BayouMafia

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    Would have been nice to give Areola a salute in front of home fans but not surprising that this lineup is low on loan players.

    Jasper and Francois are on the bench

     
  33. Love Tractor

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    So Parker officially on his way to Bournemouth.
     
  34. PJP3

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    I'm not disappointed.
     
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  35. Fran Tarkenton

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    likeable guy but did not seem like an edge was gained with his tactics
     
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  36. BayouMafia

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    Overall probably a good move. Seemed like a great locker room guy but maybe not quite up to par tactically or as a program builder. Maybe someone with a more aggressive mindset will be a benefit.

    The bigger negative is what it says about the club that our manager would walk for another Championship side right after relegation rather than stay and work on building us into a PL club. Not to mention the timing - we lost six weeks of summer time during which we could have already had the new manager in place and working on constructing a team. Hope they have someone in mind, along with an actual Director of Football
     
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  37. Gallant Knight

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    hard to know how good he is. teams promoted from the playoffs almost never stay up. if anyone was expecting a leeds type finish with that squad it just wasnt on the cards.

    probably not that difficult of a decision for him to leave. working for a trust fund baby who thinks hes a football genius is probably miserable.
     
  38. PJP3

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    I wish him well assuming he goes, and I wouldn't have been pissed to see him stay, but in the end, getting 2 points out of the last 30 told me he probably wasn't the right guy. We had enough talent to win some games, and his teams had zero idea what to do in the final 3rd, that's a lot on coaching. He always played conservatively not to loose, even when we absolutely had to have a win. Also, remember we were lucky to get promoted. We were not in the best 3 sides in the championship that year, we just got lucky. That team was nothing like the team that came up the previous promotion under Slav. That team was incredible to watch, if anyone of our coaches deserved to stay with the team and get more time, it was Slav. Put me firmly in the boat that the next guy probably won't be successful because Tony is still in charge, but still don't think Parker was the guy.
     
  39. BayouMafia

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  40. Iron Mickey

    Iron Mickey a guy who posted here like five years ago hates me
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  41. Gallant Knight

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    tony khan novelty club

    confirmed small club
     
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  42. BayouMafia

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    I wouldn’t hate the appointment of Wilder, but we desperately need a Director of Football or any selection is going to be less than optimally effective

     
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  43. Fran Tarkenton

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    Marco Silva
     
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  44. BayouMafia

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  45. TheSkeeter

    TheSkeeter Well-Known Member
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    Shows how big a club you are. Our other former managers now work at Barca. Real and Belgium respectively
     
  46. BayouMafia

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  47. BayouMafia

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  48. BayouMafia

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    Could’ve used a few of these
     
  49. PJP3

    PJP3 Well-Known Member
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    Can’t wait to go back and visit after the riverside is done. That stand is going to be such and upgrade.
     
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