Jim Harbaugh worth $9,000,000?

Not really. They beat 4 teams this year with winning records at the time

 

“At the time” is bullshit.

 

I don't know. I don't think he's done a good job this year. For him to be considered a success at UM, he's going to need to win a B1G title and at least get to the playoff at some point soon. That doesn't change the fact that most of the criticism for his first two seasons from people is stupid.

 

If you beat a 5-4 team that doesn't count?

 

Still think Harbaugh is doing a good job don't @ me

 

Opponent records are a total work in progress until the end of the year

 

I agree, but he brought it on himself and to Michigan on the rebound. But I still think he is a great coach, he needs his qb.

 

This is a convenient way of giving the person who developed that talent as little credit as possible.

 

Not if that team finishes 5-7

 

I know everyone likes to shit on Michigan and Harbaugh but the fact that he was a single blown call at Ohio State away from obliterating this dumb narrative shows how dumb the narrative is.

 

Michigan finished with losing record 3 times in the 7 years before Harbaugh. It finished ranked in the top 25 once. It was a laughing stock at the end of both RichRod and Hoke's tenures.

You really think Michigan is angry about how much money it's paying Harbaugh right now because he finished 12th in the polls the last two years?

You can dislike Harbaugh, Michigan, the coverage, the antics, or whatever you want. You can criticize his coaching ability and say he's overrated. But if you truly believe that Michigan is or should be disappointed in the financial investment it made to Harbaugh, you are an idiot.

 

Which call?

 

Totally agree. Coaches are measured on how close they are to winning games.

 

That was a Notre Dame level argument

 

The 4th down where barrett rolled for a first I assume

 

He said blown call though, that was a first down.

 

Mac won the secE his first 2 years and beat both UT and UGA so UF should be thrilled with him

 

Probably dying on this hill. Get ready.

 

Michigan used to be bad now they are good but not as good as one of the best coaches of all time yet.

 

My point was that context is important and not just the final result

 

He finished in the top 15 each of his first two years. Being 3rd in his division doesn't mean much unless that's his ceiling 5 years from now.

 

I know if you were to ask real Michigan fans they'd say they are much happier now with the product than before he was hired.

Eventually he will have to up his game.

 

Good. They've been good since Harbaugh arrived but need to get better and start beating Urban and Co. Even great coaches lose to other great coaches.

 

Lol harbaugh is a genius. Gets paid like crazy, does whatever he wants, and doesn’t have to do shit. He can coach there for as long as he lives, never win the conference, and he’s not getting fired.

 

Michigan has always been a "Go 8-4 and it's a failure." program. It's year 3, blaming Hoke doesn't work anymore. Elite coaches are competiting for NC's by year 3.

 

I got stuck on one thing, the thought of Harbaugh going to the Bears, and Michigan hiring Gruden. I'd be in stitches, legitimate stitches, because of the hernia the chuckling would cause.

 

At Michigan or anywhere?

 

Certainly not at Michigan.

 

Hard to say, they haven't had one in a very long time.

 

The ones that win them are generally there by year 3.

Historically, year 3 is generally the best barometer for success for a coaching tenure. Obviously generally speaking here, but interesting how it usually plays out that way.

 

Next year should be very interesting though. Pretty much everyone comes back plus little McCaffery to push Peters. That is the Lions fan coming through but it is true

 

Petersen in Washington is a good example of the Year 3 hypothesis in the current CFB landscape.

There's no Urban or Saban floating around out there though.

 

Yeah, I get that. I disagree that elite coaches will compete for a NC anywhere by year three or they aren’t elite. Saban didn’t at Michigan State. Dantonio didn’t at Michigan State but has been a great coach for them. Bill Snyder didn’t at Kansas State.

I get that most coaches who are going to get a title somewhere turn it around and compete within the first 3 years, but I don’t think the blanket statement works and it certainly depends on where you are at.

This isn’t defending Harbaugh though, I don’t think he is going to win a National title at Michigan.

 

Comparing the situation that Bill Snyder inherited to the situation that Jim Harbaugh inherited is a little disingenuous. Same with Dantonio at MSU. Those are not elite blue blood programs. The two simply can't be compared. And I'm not saying it can't be done, but it's rare for a coach at an elite blue blood program to struggle for his first 3 years and then rebound to build the program into championship contender. I'm sure I'm missing someone but I can't think of a coach off the top of my head at Bama/AU/LSU/UGA/UF/UT/FSU/USC/Texas/OU/UM/OSU/PSU that struggled for 3-4 years and then brought the program back to national relevance.

Comparing him to Saban and Meyer, bc that's what many like to do... Saban had Bama as #1 in the country going into the SECCG in year 2. Meyer won a NC in year 2 at UF and year 3 at OSU.

 

Even Brian Kelly had Nd undefeated in his 3rd year....well almost. But he had Nd beating teams they were suppose to beat. Harbaugh is a good coach but he needs to find a solid qb, soon

 

It'd probably be good if he realized it was 1960 anymore and updated his offense. His 2 TE I formation offense is outdated even by NFL standards. I watched 7 plays early in yesterday's game and they had 1 WR in 6 of them before going 3 WR on 3rd and long. I had to rewind to make sure I saw what I thought I saw. Tom Brady would struggle in those circumstances.

 

Harbaugh didn't struggle his first 3 years. He went 10-3 his first year with a roster that went 5-7 the year prior and a QB dumped by Iowa. He went 10-3 the second year that ended up being disappointing in terms of record but he lost all three games in the final seconds by a total of 5 points. He's struggled this year and I think he deserves criticism for some of the issues, but they replaced 17 starters.

You're never going to let go of the fact that people said he was in the same class as Saban and Urban. That's fine. It doesn't change the fact that his first two seasons would be viewed as a success if literally any other coach had done it, or if Harbaugh hadn't been the face of CFB offseasons both years.

 

Coming from a bama fan this is big. Harbaugh is stubborn, that is his strength but also his weakness.

And he is a stupid motherfucker, take football away from him and he is probably sitting outside of a seven eleven begging for some hot dogs.

 

10-3 is a success to UM fans?

And lets not act like there was no talent last year. UM had the most NFL draft picks of any school. Going 10-3 with that much talent is underachieving, regardless if you want to admit that or not.

And you're right, myself and others won't let it go that UM fans went full UT/Kiffin when Harbaugh was hired. That's why we all laugh at it now. UM fans and Harbaugh have brought them on themselves. You guys wanted everyone to look at you. Well, we're looking.

 

10-3 is a success after getting ran off the field against Maryland the year before.

 

Trust me, I was a Bama fan that loved the 2012 version where we just lined up and made people quit. The issue was if we had a day where our D just didn't have it, we were fucked. Doesn't happen often but sometimes we have games like vs Manizel or Ole Miss where shit just doesn't go right for the D. The offense couldn't go blow to blow. That was changed, mainly with Kiffin, and now we can win a shootout if we have to. No chance we beat Clemson in 2015 with our 2011 offense. Just wasn't possible.

 

I'll give you that. I'll also argue that his coaching performance has gone downhill every season since he's been there. Year 1 was a nice turnaround from the prior year. Year 2 was disappointment with a loaded roster. Year 3 UM just isn't a good football team.

 

10-3 after a 5-7 season is a success.

10-3 in 2016 wasn't a success based on expectations, but it wasn't a "struggle" either. UM was really good last year and lost close games. It sucked, but it happens.

You can laugh if you want. I don't care. If you're attempting to analyze the state of Michigan's program and Harbaugh as a coach, though, I'll respond with reasons why you're wrong when you are.

 

Last year he lost 3 games by a grand total of 5 points. It sucks but that’s sports