Correct. 3rd division clubs in domestic competition are taken seriously Football is full of interesting possibilities. I certainly would not encourage a new fan to root for Barca or Real.
Very much so. Club Deportivo Alcoyano inspired us all. Get yourself a pillow with the crest and maybe a kit tbh
Ok, but my premise is sincere and frankly it's true. It's actually very basic leftism. Axiom 1: capitalism distorts bourgeois social values You find football romantic. It's certainly painted that way. There's a high Modern aspect to it. It connects, universalizes, and transcends. That's great. Barca is more than a club. America is ok for you because you were born there. But those are all bourgeois values. What does capitalism do to it? It makes Barca a monstrous international club that treats its own values as a veneer, a brand, to sell shirts to kids in Saudi and Brazil, and apparently CDMX. There isn't actually a difference between Barca and Madrid. It's branding. It's the difference between Crest and Colgate. I like white. I like Madrid better than Barcelona as destinations. I find Castilians more pleasant to talk with over tapas than Catalans, in general. Those things guide my brand choices, because there's no ethical nugget or core by which to distinguish them. Axiom 2: consumption is not politics Me choosing to buy a product that's harder to watch or less likely to participate in the biggest competitions isn't praxis, and it doesn't mean anything. It's a direct corollary of patting myself on the back for buying eggs labeled cage free at the grocery store right beside the mass produced eggs. Edited addition for clarification: choosing to follow Leeds isn't praxis. If Leeds were in the position Chelsea are in, they'd have gone for the Super League cartel too. It's capitalism. That's what it does. It protects profits, reduces costs, and knows no bounds. Since you use an extremely right wing and gross birtherism to justify your fanhood of America, I guess I should be an Ipswich Town fan. Cool. Now it's hard as fuck to watch, and I can never share a televised competition at the local bar. The implication that I'm a MORE ETHICAL PERSON because of this consumer choice, predicated on something as supremely uncontrollable as where you're born, is not wizard brained. Proposition 1: there is no ethical consumption under capitalism QED. There's no reason for the mental gymnastics you laid out. You can feel superior to people who follow Madrid, or you can feel superior to people who choose to follow America because they win rather than because they're from the Ciudad, but it's no different from @bricktop feeling superior to Xbox gamers because he plays on a PC. It's meaningless consumer shit.
consumption politics AND shitting on Bricktop in the same post has me wanting to go sign up a few alts just to shower the post in likes
Dialectics that you laid out I’m mostly in agreement with, which is why I’ve repeated ad nauseum by now to try something new and interesting in this sport rather than what’s right in front of your face. It’s telling from the beginning of this exchange that you attack Barca’s brand, or then compare football to Fritos or caged free eggs. You didn’t even address the other more meaningful part of the post when I referenced Bielsismo. It means you haven’t really explored yet or don’t care to which is fine if that’s what you prefer. Rooting for Bielsa’s football or watching Leeds United play Wigan Athletic in the championship or watching the Copa Libertadores doesn’t make me feel superior. I simply derive infinitely much more meaningful enjoyment from it. If Bielsismo or Menottismo, as opposed to Bilardismo are the equivalents of caged free vs not and you choose to absorb football in that way well then enjoy, comrade. I will still be here poking fun at Florentino’s tentacles and Fascism FC.
I added some clarification above. Bielsa by all accounts is a great dude. It's like Gravity Payments and Dan Price. He's a good guy and worth enjoying if that's your thing but it doesn't change finance capitalism.
Oh he’s lovely and it’s very interesting to explore the contradictions. He very much has a bourgeois background and upbringing but tries very hard to embody a working class spirit and that bleeds into his work as well by appealing to the people as much as possible with a certain style of play. There is often an inevitable clash with the pitfalls of modern football which helps explain the short stints where he’s gone. His time in Chile for example was something out of a magical realism novel. I don’t gather so far you’re very much interested in all that but rather two particular clubs just caught your eye at the store and there’s not much more to it than that as you’ve laid out.
I find that sort of thing fascinating. But I don't find it a substantive difference, only a symbolic one. And I certainly don't find it grounds for moralizing.
Symbolic in terms of what? Obviously Bielsismo doesn’t challenge finance capital. His footballing philosophy certainly has made a massive difference in the sport and the surrounding actors both off the field and on and that’s what’s cool about it.
In terms of difference between these clubs, which are just products now under a global capitalist regime.
When Bielsa came to Mexico in the 90s he started a massive scouting network as a sporting director for Atlas and he unearthed players such as Pavel Pardo, Rafa Marquez, Jared Borgetti, etc He made a concrete material impact in Mexico. He was ultimately convinced to take the reins of Club America which he grew to detest due to the fact it’s owned by the biggest private media giant in Mexico.
Sure, that is the hellworld we live in and global neoliberalism has spread its tentacles into nearly every source of enjoyment whether it be sport, the arts, etc But that doesn’t mean I can’t explore in spite of it or find places where it thrives in unique ways despite the contradictions. I’m always fascinated by the reach of the sport and all that it entails. “La pelota no se mancha”
Sure, but not before making a monumental impact in youth scouting and development in Mexico. His greatest impact came as a sporting director for a small club in Mexico, not as an actual manager of the greatest club in the country’s history. I think that’s the part, the irony, and the point you’re missing out on in these exchanges.
Of course it doesn't! You're the one in here acting sanctimonious about the clubs you follow. Feel free to find unique ways to enjoy the sport despite the malignancy of neoliberalism. I encourage it. But don't mistake it for politics, or praxis, or moral superiority. How is that any different than the Dan Price parallel? Sorry, but I don't think I'm missing the nuance here.
Messi is too good and pure for this wretched earth. Honestly, being a Mexican, I commit self flagellation every time I indulge in Barca Madrid bantz and would much prefer championship bantz with you, mick, but I will make do. Having said that, I enjoy the madridista’s fickle nature with Zidane. One moment he’s a maestro, the next he’s binnable, but now he’s a total professor again. Par for the course with you scoundrels. In fact, madridistas generally speaking are truly despicable to their own. See the case of Iker Casillas. Then the way you treated Keylor Navas uuuuuf Pura vida!
Maybe if you were’t just a soulless club and were something more, idk maybe more than a club or something you’d be worthwhile follow and wouldn’t get knocked out by Alcoyano. Standard of excellence for what? It’s half assed and soulless every year. When’s the last time the club won a domestic double? The 1980s or whatever? Here at mes que un club™ domestic doubles are a routine accomplishment. We win them even amidst turmoil or turbulent times. At least City, with all the obvious baggage they have, actually give every competition and every match the respect it deserves. Is it coincidence it’s with a Catalan at the helm? I think not. Be more. Maybe win a treble for once in your soulless history idk
as the permanent Reyes de Europa and el mejor club del mundo, we approach everything in the appropriate manner because we determine what is appropriate. good luck getting a public bailout from the king you despise and or financial clemency from the crediting bodies who own you.
domestic double ah yes the Copa, the 4th most coveted trophy every year but the true measure of success
Speaking of nefarious ownership/management these images always induce tears of laughter. Known subhuman franquista sympathizer Flo was so smug on this night when he thought he successfully orchestrated a coup of football. My word.
Idk I remember the scenes in Madrid when you all last won it like a decade ago. Ramos was so uncontrollably ecstatic he dropped the copa. Total escandalo. Also have to give you credit for sweeping the clasico this year in the league something that hasn’t happened for Fascism Fc since the 70s, you know when you were still generalissimo’s play thing.
Is this supposed to be some kind of “gotcha”? I don’t know that saying losing to a 3rd tier squad (even playing mostly reserves) or that Zidane was very much on the hot seat during the stretch where they were dropping points left and right to relegation teams and had to win on the last CL match day to qualify for the knock outs is exactly a controversial statement
Absolutely fuming over a cup you don’t rate and possibly sacking the chosen one over it oh wow Peer into the mind of the modern football plastic. You tell me if there’s a gotcha you’re just telling on yourself here
lol Utterly fuming because I (correctly) pointed out how embarrassing it was to being playing that poorly? You’re too much, friend and you’ll notice that I didn’t comment on whether ZZ should be sent packing; just that he may very well be in jeopardy. Unfortunately Perez has stopped taking my calls so I don’t have an actual say in his employment.
Real Madrid is too good and sophisticated for domestic doubles. Or too good to ever win a treble it would appear.
I mean that’s what modern day Madrid tends to do rather than not. That was my original premise. Play poorly relative to their talent most of the year, shit their pants in the clasico (save for this season of course which is a monumental and rare feat for Madrid as I already laid out) get bunz’d in the copa and more often than not lose the league this past decade as well. They half ass it every year save for a few fixtures in Europe. What a club.
Circling back to this especially brilliant post, the domestic double includes the league title. Just want to make sure that’s clear. I’d rather not make assumptions.
It’s funny you say that because as the Golden Era of Barcelona, the most successful and profitable years in the club’s history, comes to a close the Champions League deficit between them and Real is larger than it’s ever been before. Even at their absolute peak they were completely and wholly outshined by the sustained success of their Rivals.
Oh wow this is another level of delusion. So according to our little normie mongoloid here, at the absolute peak of Barca, widely considered the best team in the history of the game they were obviously outshined by rivals Real Madrid the club who routinely lost the league, and was humiliated in clasicos every year including in the champions league semifinals the only tournament they really only ever rate. You are adorable. Two trebles, routine domestic doubles, a style of football+talent that transcended the history of the sport < no trebles, no doubles, and a few fluky runs in Europe. The only worthwhile season for Madrid this century was 2016-17 when they actually won the league along with Europe.
“Winning the league is more difficult than the champions league” - Zizou He won 3 straight champions leagues (again the only tourney that only matters clearly according to them) and the madridistas are looking to pounce on firing a man like that. The same club legend they trashed for sticking with Karim Benzema despite all the dumb criticisms. You don’t deserve him tbh it’s a wonder he came back.
TMP displaying why people take him so seriously and don’t ever text or PM one another to laugh at his ridiculous nonsense.
Ta bien! tbh this is still far preferable to the “beanerito” and “wetback” days of the tmb sawker board. I suspect there may be some disagreement there though.