Lawyer thread

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by Jax Teller, Apr 8, 2015.

  1. El Tiburon

    El Tiburon Well-Known Member
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    Florida Gators

    Back to back medical malpractice trials. Each of them has been a little over three weeks long apiece. Finished the first one on a Wednesday then started up the new one the following Monday.
     
  2. Tilly

    Tilly Souf Cack
    Donor TMB OG
    South Carolina Gamecocks

    Side discussion for what may become a thing for me. I have a vacation planned to Thailand for December 26 through January 12. Been on the calendar for over a year. I have orders of protection in every county in the state.

    Well, my boss scheduled a trial for the first week in January when I'll be gone. This is an important case to him where he would generally rely on me to run point on prep and/or take a meaningful role in trial prep.

    Normally I wouldn't be concerned, but all but one of our staff that we would normally use probably won't be available to assist in prep (one leaving for another job at the end of the year, one has health issues and is trying to cut back on that kind of stressful work, the other has a son who will be home from a year long deployment most of December and my January). The one staff member who will be available, my boss doesn't trust.

    I'm guessing my boss will ask me to cancel my vacation if by mid December it looks like this thing is going to trial. What is my ask for compensation in the event he does that?
     
  3. Tilly

    Tilly Souf Cack
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    Who the hell handles your scheduling to get back to back 3 week trials? That's inexcusable.
     
  4. CoastalOrange

    CoastalOrange Well-Known Member
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    A billion dollars.

    Obviously kidding but definitely something outrageous. Like you calling out the scheduling above, your vacation has been on for a year. Your boss either didn't care enough to concern himself enough to look or looked and didn't care. My vacations are too impt for my sanity to bail without being majorly compensated.
     
  5. Gallant Knight

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    Can you not get some sort of continuance?
     
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  6. Craig Pettis

    Craig Pettis Que será será motherfucker
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    F494482B-111D-4B52-9E07-334A1B3FE022.gif
     
  7. wes tegg

    wes tegg I'm a Guy's guy, guys.
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    The judge?
     
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  8. Gallant Knight

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    apparently one of the arguments defense counsel plans on making at a trial i have in jan/feb is that my client is overweight and thats why she has back pain.

    i think she is like 220 lbs.

    i really really really hope that happens.
     
  9. (Z)

    (Z) Well-Known Member
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    Alabama Crimson TideBoston Red Sox

    Spent an entire day at mediation.

    (1) One of the 3 corporate Defendants shows up 1 hour and 15 minutes late;

    (2) We never got an offer. Everybody agrees my lady is due to be paid, and I'm thinking a lot, but all of these indemnity agreements, they're arguing over who should pay.

    Why did I even go? Glad they paid for the whole thing. We're going to light a fire under them pretty soon. Great Plaintiff's case in a TERRIBLE venue (for Defendants). My only worry will be to keep the verdict at a reasonable level that I can hang onto on appeal.
     
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  10. colonel_forbin

    colonel_forbin Well-Known Member
    Donor

    My partner does a lot of divorce work. His client and client's wife relocate here for his work. The wife was upset because she was leaving all of her friends and whatnot. She decides she wants to start breeding some species of rare cat and he goes along with it to make her happy. The marriage doesn't work out but they're still living together at the moment while the divorce gets done.

    They have 32 cats in the house.
     
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  11. Gallant Knight

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    one of my paralegals just gave her 2 weeks notice. this is the first time it's happened with my firm in its current form of having 8 of us here.

    how have yall dealt with this? i'm just going to get my associate to make sure that all her tasks are up to date and that any cases she manages are good to go. i don't plan on having her train her replacement.

    i guess i need to get her to sign some sort of resignation letter to protect myself from her trying to get unemployment?

    i was also planning on giving her a 10% raise and an extra paycheck holiday bonus so this will save me $10k
     
  12. 941Gator

    941Gator TMB's resident beach bum
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    Florida Gators

    have her do an exit interview and make every question about yourself and then post the answers on tmb. thanks.
     
  13. Gallant Knight

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    she will bitch about my softball schedule i'm sure.
     
  14. RJF-GUMP

    RJF-GUMP Daubert Qualified in Cooler Thermodynamics
    Donor TMB OG

    there's really not that much to do. start looking for a replacement.
     
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  15. nexus

    nexus TMB’s TSO
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    Just how important is it to him? Had a similar situation a couple years ago where an assoc. was asked to postpone a vacation she had scheduled for 9+ months less than 3 weeks before she was supposed to leave. Managing partner reimbursed her whatever she couldn't get refunded, covered the entire cost of her new trip and gave her a grand in cash to get drunk on him. No idea what your relationship is like with your boss but I'd start there.
     
  16. nexus

    nexus TMB’s TSO
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    Are you ever not on vacation?
     
  17. CoastalOrange

    CoastalOrange Well-Known Member
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    Officially? Plenty. Unofficially? Not so much.

    Leaving on Thursday for another.
     
  18. Big Meech

    Big Meech I like turtles
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    Lmao. Sometimes you have to do stuff you don't like or give up something you don't want to when someone has the title "boss."
     
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  19. Gallant Knight

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    Agreed. Asking someone to give up a vacation they’ve had planned for a year is a big ask though. And if you don’t handle it the right way you’re at a risk of them finding a new job
     
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  20. Big Meech

    Big Meech I like turtles
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    Agreed. It would be. But there isn't no shortage of young lawyers.
     
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  21. Gallant Knight

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    Simple solution is to allow no vacation time
     
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  22. BrickTamland

    BrickTamland You're not Ron...
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    Florida State Seminoles

    Any of you in upstate NY?
     
  23. El Tiburon

    El Tiburon Well-Known Member
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    Florida Gators

    I do defense work so this doesn’t really apply to me, other than out of curiosity. For you plaintiff guys, does anyone actually use those lawyer referral services/lead generating firms in their practice? I ask because I get fucking bombarded with solicitation emails that I just delete as a matter of course, however given the volume of those emails I get I can only assume those services must be somewhat viable. Do those things really work?
     
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  24. CoastalOrange

    CoastalOrange Well-Known Member
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    You sound like a fun, reasonable boss to have.

    I had that kind of Boss my first legal job and it almost turned me off from the field entirely. Most young people, not just attorneys, have no problem working hard and putting in the hours (I say "most young people" but I am really only speaking from my experiences with friends and colleagues). But when treated as completely disposable and someone (i.e. a "boss") doesn't give a shit about you or your requested time off, then it makes it easy to not give a shit about the "boss" or the firm/company either. As Gallant Knight said, a true boss would see it as a big ask and handle it properly.
     
  25. harvey birdman

    harvey birdman Ha ha! Last laugh.
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    A woman called my job this week and I had to let her know that I work in-house. She also sent an email to our department's shared inbox.
     
    #8775 harvey birdman, Nov 13, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
  26. Gallant Knight

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    I have not. Have always wondered if it is ethical to use them
     
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  27. BUstang

    BUstang Lawyer

    Much like everything else, it depends. There are legitimate ones. There are others that have called my clients months after they've signed with us, convince them they are a lawyer assisting on the case and then tell them they need to meet in order to sign additional paperwork.
     
  28. El Tiburon

    El Tiburon Well-Known Member
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    Florida Gators

    My gut tells me those services are a scam. A plaintiff attorney friend of mine met with a rep from one of those companies once and said they wanted to charge like $2,000 a month to send him cases. I think he actually did it for a month or two and said all of the cases sucked. But the fact that they keep marketing so much tells me that at least someone out there is making money.
     
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  29. wes tegg

    wes tegg I'm a Guy's guy, guys.
    Staff Donor
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    The problem is, at least when you’re billing hours, the young lawyer isn’t making anyone money when he/she isn’t billing. Until you’re generating work, you are a disposable resource. That’s why the “paying your dues” ethos is so pervasive in the practice of law, and it’s not really all that easy to change.

    And, from a management perspective, it goes both ways. Associates can leave at the drop of a hat and take a lot of your time investment with them.
     
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  30. Gallant Knight

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    Are y’all paying per lead or per month

    we had someone offer us X per cat wreck we signed up

    Didn’t sound ethical and we can’t handle any more volume without hiring more people and moving offices which I don’t want to do for another 12-18 months
     
  31. BUstang

    BUstang Lawyer

    We've never used them. My experience with them is solely solicitation to us and then trying to steal our clients.
     
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  32. RJF-GUMP

    RJF-GUMP Daubert Qualified in Cooler Thermodynamics
    Donor TMB OG

    NOLO MVA leads is the only one we use. We get bombarded with a billion of them and I delete as a matter of course as well.
     
  33. Big Meech

    Big Meech I like turtles
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    wes tegg nailed it. Your perspective changes when you look at it from the equity side/business owner side. Ultimately, it's a business that's either making money or not making money. To be perfectly frank, there are not too many associates that are not disposable. Don't get me wrong, there are those that entirely grasp the legal concepts as well as understand business generation and you do what you can to hang onto those associates and grow them.

    Don't get me wrong, I think you are just a bad person if you treat young lawyers/associates/anyone like shit. However, I've been in many roles that touch on this issue. Hiring partner. Associate-partner liaison, etc. I've heard all the complaints. At the end of the day, if you are not exceptional at what you do or a great business generator, there are a lot of very smart young lawyers that can be hired to replace you.
     
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  34. Tiger Tiger Woods Y'all

    Tiger Tiger Woods Y'all Putting big balls in little holes, circa 1995
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    The lawyer referral services are ran by some of the seediest mother fuckers out there, and I have met with plenty... my company funds imaging centers, plantiff funding bizz, class action funding, and chiros. The referral folks are the worst.
     
  35. Gallant Knight

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    haha that says a lot for someone who works as a loanshark
     
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  36. Tiger Tiger Woods Y'all

    Tiger Tiger Woods Y'all Putting big balls in little holes, circa 1995
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    For the record I still only work for the imaging company. I turned down the opportunity to run the funding company.
     
  37. Gallant Knight

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    andddd i'm 70% sure my legal assistant is leaving because she is super behind on everything and we were going to discovery it today in our quarterly case meeting.

    lovely
     
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  38. 941Gator

    941Gator TMB's resident beach bum
    Staff Donor
    Florida Gators

    Motion is ok/decent. I was able to cite Hustler Magazine, have to appreciate that.

    upload_2019-11-13_15-25-31.png
     
  39. colonel_forbin

    colonel_forbin Well-Known Member
    Donor

    It's unreal. Not just from them, but from website and search engine optimization people, reps trying to sell commercial spots, etc. People must be getting ripped off for this business to be like it is.
     
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  40. Nug

    Nug MexicanNug
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    Just had lunch with my boss regarding upcoming evals/raises/etc. First time I've asked for a meeting prior to my eval so I can put out a number/express what I'm thinking beforehand.

    Meeting went just OK. My boss agreed my work product is fine, get more than enough hours, etc. But then he brought up "you have a pretty robust travel schedule..." Then steered towards the partnership talk -- "being a partner is more than just a full-time job, you can't jet off for 2 weeks and still get things done ... yes, you bill hours, but it's not the same as being in the office." More or less insinuated that if I want to make partner, I need to cut down on traveling and focus more on marketing/building a book of business.

    Man I about vomited. I guess I knew this was coming, but I'm of the same mindset as the above in bold. Zero desire to make partner, but when do I tell them? How do I tell them? If I do tell them, do they fire me? My firm 100% envisions a partnership track for me (and likely for all associates). I 100% do not have that vision.

    I guess there will be a reckoning in a year or so. I already have like 3 trips planned for 2020, and I'm not canceling. Maybe ride it out for one more year and then inform them I have different ideas about my future here. Couldn't help but think of this post after that lunch.
     
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  41. harvey birdman

    harvey birdman Ha ha! Last laugh.
    Donor
    ArsenalFlorida Gators

    Start updating your resume. No point in not preparing to go somewhere new on your own terms.
     
  42. Brandon Chicken

    Brandon Chicken Chow Time
    Donor

    Could you not be an “of counsel” or something similar? If your work product is good and you are producing for the firm they might not want to get rid of you just because you don’t want to be a partner. Probably sacrifice some money but seems like a conversation worth having. If you have a good relationship with your boss I’d do it sooner than later.
     
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  43. 941Gator

    941Gator TMB's resident beach bum
    Staff Donor
    Florida Gators

    At some point would the raises hit a ceiling if you weren’t on a partner track?
     
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  44. Nug

    Nug MexicanNug
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    I have some thinking to do. My eval is in mid-December, so if I was going to have that talk, that would be the time to do it.

    Yes, I assume so. There are 2 lawyers at the firm that are NOT on partnership track, going to try and grab a beer with them in the near future.
     
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  45. RJF-GUMP

    RJF-GUMP Daubert Qualified in Cooler Thermodynamics
    Donor TMB OG

    Spent the entire afternoon briefing/ researching how to hold on discovery regarding driver history and vehicle maintenance even after the direct negligence claims for supervision /maintenance/etc in a tractor trailer case are dismissed. I hate Case Text btw. Westlaw is just so expensive though. Hell, if it were up to me we'd probably still have Westlaw and just get ripped off for it. However, it turns out that there is really good law on this for plaintiffs. Well, how the hell else would you ever get punitives? See below:

    However, Plaintiff asserted independent claims for punitive damages against Ecuanic. This Court has previously implied - if not explicitly held - that a plaintiff's independent claims for punitive damages against an employer may proceed despite the employer's admission that its employee was acting in the course and scope of employment.

    Therefore, evidence pertaining to the employer's independent gross negligence would not be superfluous or redundant, as there is no means for a plaintiff to obtain punitive damages against the employer solely through claims against the employee.Accordingly, while dismissal of Plaintiff's simple negligence claims against Ecuanic - for which no punitive damages may be awarded - is appropriate, dismissal of Plaintiff's gross negligence claims against Ecuanic would be inappropriate at this time.
     
  46. RJF-GUMP

    RJF-GUMP Daubert Qualified in Cooler Thermodynamics
    Donor TMB OG

    I'm probably just spinning my wheels though, actually get a punitive instruction is near impossible.
     
  47. Gallant Knight

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    Not surprised your travel schedule is an issue. You would really have to find a specific firm where that is encouraged. It sounds like this definitely will not be the firm that lets you do you bill half the hours and make half as much. I’m not sure that is even a workable model doing PI insurance defense
     
  48. colonel_forbin

    colonel_forbin Well-Known Member
    Donor

    I've never worked at a defense firm so I honestly don't know how it works, but it's weird to me that that would be an issue. If I'm a partner at a big firm and I can get great work from an experienced lawyer for many years -- basically a guy that's giving you the work product of a partner and maybe brings some business in along the way -- and I'll only ever have to pay him an associate's salary, with the one catch that he has a "robust" travel schedule, I'm all for that. What am I missing? Maybe just worried about a lack of commitment?
     
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  49. Nug

    Nug MexicanNug
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  50. colonel_forbin

    colonel_forbin Well-Known Member
    Donor

    We actually had a guy doing that at my old firm. He lived in Oakland and was our primary brief writer for a year and a half before he ended up taking another job out there. We now contract a guy in Birmingham every once in a while on a project-by-project basis. We've probably paid him ~$10,000 this year, but the majority of that was paid by a client in one of our few hourly cases.

    Contract writing would be great for you if you can find consistent work, but finding consistent work is the hard part.
     
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