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Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by hood b. goode, Jun 17, 2022.
I hate Pat Riley so fucking much
Never thought he'd make it in the league, figured he'd be trying his hand at the MLB by now. Good for him
Ivey had the greatest 5 min of summer league I’ve ever seen so I’m ready to declare him GOAT.
Ivey > Jordan
Ainge be Ainging
....what's with the new thread title and icon
If you have to ask, you can't afford it.
its hood b. goode ’s favorite body part
Im afraid Braun and Watson might be busts after last nights game. Very nervous now.
If you're taken after like pick 15 you can't even be a bust
What if they are so bad they aren't even in the league after their rookie contract expires? That seems like bust to me.
That's like average value for a pick in the 20s and later
ESPN's writers came up with different Mitchell deals. That last one is wild and seems like an insane amount for PHX to give up for Durant.
The Knicks get their star
New York receives:
Knicks' 2023, 2025 and 2027 first-round picks
Mavericks' 2023 pick (top-10 protected)
Wizards' 2023 pick (top-14 protected)
The Knicks already landed one of the guards they watched when a couple of their high-ranking executives just happened to show up in prime seats for the Jazz-Mavericks playoff series opener, poaching Jalen Brunson from Dallas in free agency.
It's no secret Mitchell has been atop the Knicks' wish list since Leon Rose was hired to run the franchise. The Jazz, as proven by the haul Utah received in the Gobert deal, want to stock up on first-round picks, create financial flexibility and take some fliers on inexpensive young talent.
This deal would be a win in all of those departments and launch the Jazz into a full-fledged rebuild with a ton of draft capital as the foundation of that project.
The Knicks are loaded with picks, owning all of their own moving forward and protected 2023 picks from Dallas, Detroit and Washington, although the latter two are likely to convey in later years.
Those picks were stockpiled in hopes of parlaying them into a proven star like Mitchell. Toppin has shown promise and has two years left on his rookie deal. Reddish, a former No. 10 overall pick, and McBride would be swings at young players with no guaranteed salary beyond the 2022-23 season.
Fournier has three years and $55.9 million remaining on his contract, including a team option in the final season, and would be a strong candidate to be traded elsewhere at some point.
Gay, 35, was a healthy scratch in the playoffs and is due $12.7 million over the next two seasons, so the Jazz will be motivated to unload him in a Mitchell deal.
-- Tim MacMahon
Bienvenido a Miami, Mitchell
2023, 2027 and 2029 first-round picks
Oklahoma City receives:
2025 first-round pick via Miami (protections removed)
2024 second-round pick (top-50 protected)
2028 and 2029 second-round picks
Once upon a time, the Heat could point to Herro as the kind of centerpiece in a deal that might compensate for their inability to offer as many draft picks as the Knicks.
With the haul the Jazz got for Gobert, though, that argument likely went out the window. To have any hope of landing Mitchell, Miami would likely have to offer both Herro and a full arsenal of picks. Doing so requires involving the Thunder, who own the Heat's 2025 first-round pick with top-14 protection after the two teams altered the terms prior to this year's deadline.
To amend them again and remove the protection on what could become a weaker pick with Mitchell in Miami, Oklahoma City picks up all three remaining Heat second-round picks. With that protection removed, Miami can offer three unprotected first-round picks plus Nikola Jovic, the No. 27 pick in the 2022 draft (because Jovic signed his rookie contract July 2, this deal couldn't be finalized until Aug. 1, a waiting period that shouldn't affect things much at this part of the offseason).
In addition to Herro and Jovic, Utah gets Duncan Robinson (for matching salary purposes) and Gabe Vincent, who has developed into a quality contributor with one year remaining at a minimum salary.
Lastly, the Heat sweeten this offer by taking back Jazz center Udoka Azubuike, who's unlikely to be part of the team's long-term plans.
At some point, Miami might have to consider whether giving up all of the team's draft equity for Mitchell is worth it with a Durant trade still possible. To some extent, that decision hinges on the Heat's timetable.
Durant turns 34 in September, which puts him in the same range as Miami starters Jimmy Butler (33 in September) and Kyle Lowry (36).
By contrast, the 25-year-old Mitchell would reset the Heat's timeline and align it with 24-year-old center Bam Adebayo. And if Miami doesn't think the Nets will ultimately trade Durant, this might be its best chance to land a third star while Butler is in his late prime.
-- Kevin Pelton
Mitchell moves north
Gary Trent Jr.
Khem Birch 2023, 2025 and 2027 first-round picks
The Raptors would be upgrading their lineup with a bona fide franchise offense creator. Mitchell ranked No. 1 among shooting guards in real plus-minus last season, with the seventh-best offensive RPM score in the league (trailing only Giannis Antetokounmpo, Trae Young, Luka Doncic, Stephen Curry, Nikola Jokic and LeBron James).
The Raptors have one of the most talented and unique frontcourts in the NBA, and adding Mitchell to 2022 All-Star Fred VanVleet in the backcourt would allow them to become legitimate contenders in the East.
The Jazz would receive a package akin to what they received in the Gobert deal. Trent is a good young wing at only 23 years old, and the three additional No. 1s would raise their stockpile to eight extra No. 1s (in addition to their own) over the next five years, competing with the Thunder for the largest cache in the league.
-- Andre Snellings
OKC cashes in some of its draft chips
Oklahoma City receives:
2024 Utah first-round pick (from the Favors trade)
2024 Clippers first-round pick (top-2 protected)
2024 Rockets first-round pick (if 5-30)
2025 Heat first-round pick (top-14 protected)
2025 76ers first-round pick (if 7-30)
After appearing in the playoffs 10 out of 11 seasons, Oklahoma City has taken a methodical approach on how its roster is being constructed.
Instead of possessing All-Stars such as Russell Westbrook, Durant, James Harden and Chris Paul, the Thunder have started a rebuild that centers around a young core -- Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, Josh Giddey, Chet Holmgren, an abundance of draft capital and future cap flexibility.
For head of basketball operations Sam Presti, roster sustainability is the only goal in how this team is put together. Presti has preached patience, but there will be a time when the Thunder will be faced with a decision.
Do they push some of their draft equity to the middle for a chance to acquire a player such as Mitchell, or wait until the next disgruntled All-Star becomes available and continue to focus on player development in the meantime?
A Mitchell trade to the Thunder does not mean the first-round picks Presti accumulated are wiped clean, though. Instead of unprotected firsts that opposing teams will offer Utah, Oklahoma City should take the quantity over quality approach.
The five first-round picks in the trade (including the Jazz first in 2024 that was sent in the Derrick Favors trade) are considered tier-B draft picks. None of them are the Thunder's own and each has some type of protection in at least the first year.
The Thunder would also retain the two unprotected firsts (2024 and 2026) that were acquired in the Paul George trade, along with a top-five protected first from Houston in 2026 and a Denver top-six protected first in 2027.
For Utah, is a blue-chip prospect like guard Tre Mann and an unprecedented five first-round picks the best offer on the board? Or should they take the Thunder's offer and leverage a team like the Knicks to offer more.
Including the four first-round picks acquired in the Gobert trade, Utah would have the most first-round picks of any team, while also setting a goal much like what Oklahoma City is currently doing -- building roster sustainability.
-- Bobby Marks
The trade that might break NBA Twitter
Phoenix picks in 2023, 2025, 2027 and 2029
Phoenix swaps in 2024, 2026 and 2028
Let's just wrap up all league business for the summer and go home. In this deal, the following things would get taken care of:
• Durant would get out of Brooklyn, as he'd like to do, and would go to the Suns, one of the teams he said he'd like to play for.
• Deandre Ayton would get the big payday that he'd like, and the Suns would move on from him after it seemed both sides were ready for a breakup after Phoenix's disappointing second-round exit against the Mavericks. Moving Ayton to Indiana in a swap for Turner would also solve some of the base year compensation issues that will make a sign-and-trade deal for him difficult because of Indiana's cap space.
• Utah gets an absolute haul for Mitchell, getting Phoenix's draft picks for the next several years in addition to taking a free swing on Simmons.
• Brooklyn gets Mitchell, Bridges and Turner back for Durant, allowing this team to move forward with a young, intriguing core while also having the flexibility to move on from Kyrie Irving in another deal if the Nets so choose. The deal also prevents Brooklyn from going completely backwards after giving up several years of control over its draft picks in last year's Harden trade.
It goes without saying that executing a four-team trade like this would be no easy feat. But it would shake everything up across the board and accomplish current objectives for all teams involved.
-- Tim Bontemps
I like that move for Toronto a lot. Not sure if Toronto would be willing to part with so many picks (and it may require more than 3 if Gobert just brought back 5) but Mitchell balances that roster out a fair amount.
Wild evaluation swings from game to game are what summer league is all about.
I didn't watch last night but from what I've seen it seems like they both defend as expected which is the main thing Denver drafted them for so that's good. Braun's shooting will almost definitely come around to at least passable. I think if he can consistently hit like 37% of his threes he's already a back end of rotation guy in the NBA. That's also probably his ceiling though. Watson is definitely a high upside high bust potential guy that could go either way but that's why you roll the dice on him at 30.
So Phoenix is giving up Mikal Bridges, Ayton, 4 1st round picks, 3 pick swaps for 34 year old Kevin Durant who just posted the worst WS/48 of his last 10 seasons, has previously torn his Achilles and will be making 53 million in 4 seasons?
Don’t see how that wouldn’t work out well for them.
Yeah, it’s a disaster but there’s no way the Suns give all that up… and if they do I don’t care if it gets one title and then goes to shit immediately
If that offer was on the table my guess is Durant would be a Sun already.
if you have no intention of re-signing Ayton, are you really losing him if he's part of a S&T?
Well, that’s beyond dumb as well. You still deserved to be criticized for it.
No way Phoenix does that deal. That completely ruin your future to give you a one or two year window to win a title and I'm not even sure they would be the favorites with that team. Paul is bound to hit the wall at any time and who knows with Durant.
I am not sure Durant gets moved if Brooklyn is looking to fleece anyone wanting him. I am not sure what he's worth if Gobert is worth 4 first round picks but he's definitely not worth all that.
I don’t even think that improves Phoenix’s chances at a title. Just run it back and don’t lose all your picks/ammo for another trade.
Does phoenix match that?
Glad they learned their lesson from the years of Sabonis Turner awkwardness
They have to match or he walks for nothing
You match and trade him after Jan 15. Only problem is you can’t trade him to Indiana now for a year
So they can't do the Turner trade now that he's signed the offer sheet, right? They either match or he walks for nothing?
I'm wondering if Woj is picking his words carefully with using "agreed to" and not signed.
Phoenix really fucked around and found out
0% chance Turner stays now.
Pacers will trade Turner if Phoenix doesn't match. They'll get less for him in that scenario because teams know that they're not going to go through the Turbonis scenario all over again, but there's plenty of teams that have been interested in him. Offer sheet is the far better path for the Pacers, but nobody thought ownership would do it.
he can’t sign until midnight. Actually a very small window here for suns to do a sign and trade
Simon is hellbent on working out S/T's for some reason.
Seems the prevailing thought is they most likely will
Dickie finally got a big man
Dude is getting old and probably has one more rebuild left in him.
Still was not expecting the "fuck it, let's do it and be legends" approach.
Marks acting like that's not on the table
this is him assuming the offer sheet will be signed by Ayton (which woj is reporting he will)
I guess I'm with you in thinking they should be able to work out a SnT in the next 8.5 hours though right? Maybe I'm misreading Marks's tweet
Yes they could in the next 8.5 hours technically. Problem is they have no leverage within this very small window