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Discussion in 'TV Board' started by Jack Parkman, Aug 10, 2015.
also please stop fucking with clementine
they went and killed off james marsden and emily bae and then fucking abandoned elsie bae
fuck that episode
maybe reveals was a bad word to use
more like major plot twists
mainly ford in the cradle, delores turning on teddy after letting him smash
also mib stashing his profile in slaughterhouse five was a nice touch
William/MIB is my favorite character but I agree with some reviews I’ve read that they are being way too vague about what exactly are these horrible things he’s done to his family. Does some video of William in a pretend world make his wife kill herself? There has to be something more there, right?
It showed her that her husband's presentation to the real world is all an act like she thought. His profile showed him to be the absolute monster that she thought he was. She then killed herself. William is pretty fucked up. Wouldn't surprise me if he's fucked his family up mentally as well.
Yeah it would really bother me if watched video my wife getting railed by a robot. I'd still watch tho
And now he's murdered his daughter* so there's that.
So the show definitely wants us to believe MIB is a host (which I've thought for some time) and I'm still not convinced that his daughter was not a host but it's clear that's what the show wants us to believe.
season’s closing really strong imo
how else would she have his profile card that his wife hid in her ballerina box
Ford likely made more than one of them.
I have no doubt they want us to believe she's the real daughter and that is likely is the case but I read so many theories I always think I'm being tricked with this show.
Way more cold blooded to off himself in front of her.
Also he was programmed to protect her.
Super Maeve about to level up again
"unlock core permissions"
And the brothel chick is now carrying a host virus, or something.
And seems like everyone is heading to the same place now.
Her name is Clementine
It feels way too obvious that they want us to think MiB is a host. With the scenes where Bernard is hooked up to a comp through his forearm, and then we get MiB digging into his forearm with a knife. Not to mention the song lyrics to end the show.
So maybe there’s some other twist with it?
So looking at the preview of next episode it is going to flood. We know that the whole area is later flooded and Bernarnold says "I killed them all." We don't know if he's Bernard, Arnold, Ford, some other host put in his body, ect.
If she got the profile card out of the ballerina box then why did she tell William that the box was never recovered after she threw it away? It's possible that she was lying to William or misleading him but it's also possible that there was a gap in the park's copy of her that never knew where she would have gotten the profile card from.
He was pretty much gaslighting his wife for their entire marriage. She probably caught glimpses of the true William which led to her eventually suspecting him of being an awful person and then she had the stories from Logan about what he did in the park but his ultra-philanthropic public image still had her doubting herself. Then, like you said, his profile card confirmed both her suspicions and Logan's stories so, just like her brother before her and for a lot of the same reasons, she checked out via OD.
I took all of that as she threw away the ballerina box and her mom took it out of the trash / threw out the rest of the trash before the daughter went back to get it.
Then the mom kept the box until she offed herself ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Right, that's what happened, but the possible bot version of her didn't seem to know that and the real her would have known that if she had the profile card since she would have gotten it out of the box.
I think she was trying to manipulate William in to convincing him she didnt blame him for the suicide.
It's also entirely possible William didnt know his wife recovered the box, unless I missed something.
Yeah, I think it's a possibility that she was misleading him and maybe she was holding onto the bit about her mom having the box for her reveal of having the profile card. I just think she could have been even more convincing about blaming herself for the suicide if she said something about how her mom found the box in the trash and held onto it all those years. I think it's just more likely that Emily's knowledge of her mother having the box and recovering the profile card from it was too recent for the park to have that information on her copy. I'm definitely not anywhere close fully convinced that park Emily was a host. I just think it's a strong possibility right now. Early on I thought William was just being exactly what his profile says he is (paranoid, persecutory delusional) with regards to her being a host but now that he seems convinced she was real and he killed her I think he was right about her from the start.
And I don't think William really knew anything about the box.
Didn't the Spice World scenes confirm that the Emily in the park was a human?
Edit: On second thought I guess not. I think they confirmed that the guy was a human b/c the shot didn't kill him. But it didn't confirm that Emily was human iirc
Yeah, she shot him for the test but he didn't get to return the favor. She did however talk about coming in on the train with the same people they found dead in that tent in the Raj but Teddy always arrived on the train as well so not really a tell.
But what has William done that’s so bad in the real world that is confirmed by his wife watching his profile? It is presented, at least to me, that William hides his Westworld behavior went he returns. Why does she think he’s a monster? There has to have been something he’s done to her, other than his Westworld behavior but that’s where they are being extremely vague about it. To me, his whole backstory is extremely thin/weak and if we didn’t get it last night, then we aren’t going to get anything else.
Well you could argue that illegally scanning everyone's brains to make hosts of anyone in the park could be a bad thing. From his wife's point of view, "the real world" isn't the real William. The real William is the MIB that's in Westworld, where he can be his true self. He all but confirms it in his monologue when he thinks she's asleep.
We don't know exactly why she did what she did but it obviously has something to do with William.
Got way behind on TV shows, so I have just now binged this one and got caught up. I'm reading this thread from the start and thoroughly enjoying the early "Bernard is/is not a robot" and "William is/is not MIB" pissing matches.
Could have done with more Sela Ward.
What was the point of Ford giving that card/chip to William? Just basically stuff he's done in Westworld? I couldn't quite tell what was on it except for videos of him abusing Delores
He was calling out his hypocrisy.
In addition to abusing Delores, there was video of him banging Delores, killing Maeve and her daughter, ect.
Basically all the shit we've seen him do.
Yeah but wasn't the evening to honor William, hosted by others to more or less celebrate his success? Maybe I'm wrong but I don't think I've seen old man William try to act like he's some great person. He kinda is who he is and others seem to laud him for his success. At least that was my interpretation.
the whole episode was him saying how everyone sees this one side of him but his wife was the only one that saw through to the dark side of him
Yes but there is a difference in someone being able to see something inside and him being a hypocrite and actively promoting himself to be something he is not. I'm just saying that I have never seen old William claim to be an angel or to be a good guy to anyone, and thus I do not consider him to be a hypocrite.
Which makes me wonder what was Ford's point? Just to expose that he does fucked up stuff in WW? So did Logan, so do a large percentage of people who visit the park. It's not a big deal, just wondering out loud
The gala was about honoring him for donating so much to charity and such
The new programmer is over the top douche I hope Maeve does some diabolical shit to him with her new magic
Hard to get any kind of read on the daughter daughtobot. Her reasons for being in the park / coming to find him seem to change every episode.
I think what dump was trying to say is for your first paragraph this episode was trying to explain that through all these characters opinions about him without actually showing you scenes of him promoting himself as a good guy. They’re giving that part of his character to you through everyone he’s close with IRL telling him he’s a two faced POS evil person. You’re right about most people doing fucked up shit at Westworld albeit most of the time it’s probably fucking robots and killing a few bad guys. But be honest the generalization “everyone does fucked up stuff in WW” is real broad and there are levels of bad shit, ie- average joe shooting a bad guy while out with a sherif tracking down bandits in a story. Vs torturing hosts to get some answers to a game or executing children in front of their parents and even some of the unnecessary shit Logan did just for kicks.
I personally thought that hypocrite comment was geared towards the Delos/Owners “deal” they made and Ford possibly saying he knew that William was on the verge of crossing the line. And possibly gave him the profile as a way of saying you fuck up my world I can fuck yours up too
The security detail that found MiB and his daughter scanned both of them to clear them from being hosts. Not arguing either way, just pointing that out.
I thought they were killed before completeting her scan
Correct. He killed them before completing the scan.
And even if she had passed the scan... so did Bernard. The scan is simply for the small explosive device installed in hosts' spines. Bernard doesn't have once since Ford wanted him to appear human at all times. Maeve doesn't have one either because she had Felix/Sylvester make sure her new body was made without one after she and Hector had their burn death in season 1. I would imagine if Ford did create an Emily host that she wouldn't have the device either.
I have alot of mixed emotions about this last weeks episode
on the one hand, its hard for me to see how Juliet could see a few minutes (?) of William clips in Westworld and that would push her over the edge to kill herself. Especially when it seems she has always pretty much known and despised him.
But then again, as we have seen recently, you never know how close someone can be and what could trigger them. Seems she was in a very bad place and William had essentially ruined her family. Plus her daughter sort of turning on her.
I really was hoping/expecting some form of William redemption, so him killing his daughter really surprised me and I am not sure where his story finishes up. I just dont think Ed Harris comes back another season as William.
Overall, I think the finally has a ton of story to tie up and finish in 1 episode. I have been giving the creators the benefit of the doubt for the whole season, so I wont stop now. Will be interesting to see where it goes.
I just cant see a scenario where we are back in Westworld for season 3? At least not as the main location right?
I think it's possible next season is more about rebuilding it. Maybe they go heavy into its initial development with young William
if this gets us more Liam McPoyle than I am for it
He also told her that her suspicions were true and that he never loved her. That’s pretty devastating after that many years and having a kid together.
I guess there was a screening of the finale in the UK. The non-spoiler reviews are that it's outstandingly good (better than the first season's finale) and very complex while answering a lot of questions but also posing many more. And if you're someone who feels that the second season has been a bit of a letdown, then the finale is vindication.
Yea fair point I forgot about that part of it
even before the profile or Williams confession she seemed bent on not going back to the looney bin at all costs