New HBO Series: Westworld

Discussion in 'TV Board' started by Jack Parkman, Aug 10, 2015.

  1. Babou

    Babou ocelot
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    Explanation of ending from the producer

    Of course in that final showdown with Dolores, she rigs his gun and he basically blows off his own arm. Now, what we tried to do there is establish this context: he collapses on the ground, [Dolores and Bernard] go down, Dolores and Bernard have all the events that unfold down there. After Bernard kills Dolores, he goes to the elevator and you’re like, “Wait, the Man in Black! I think he’s gotten up and he’s coming down this elevator and they’re gonna meet! They’re gonna meet!”

    And then it’s totally weird because no one is in that elevator. And that’s our only little clue that something is not what we thought. That there is something else happening here. And that’s what we pay off later.

    ‘Cause in reality, a man got his arm shot off. He’s just lying on the ground somewhere. And later on, when Hale, or Halores is leaving the park, you see him on a cot. He’s injured, but he’s alive, and he’s real, and he’s going out into the real world — along with a handbag of pearls and Halores.

    But then when you see that post-credit vignette, it’s really just a tease of what’s to come. We kind of rounded out that story. And you’re totally right about the end and this is a tease as to what’s to come, because we see that one tiny bit where we thought he might be coming down an elevator. We see that pay off and we see again Katja Herbers [Emily] who he thinks, “Are you my daughter? What the f–k is this?”

    But he’s in a very different timeline. The whole place looks destroyed, and then she explains that all of that stuff happened long ago. That was real. But now something has happened and the Man is now the subject — or some iteration of the Man is now the subject — of testing. The roles have become completely reversed.

    And we get the feeling that, in the far-flung future, the Man has been somehow reconjured and brought into this world and he’s being tested the same way the humans used to test the Hosts. And that is a storyline that one day we’ll see more of.

    TheWrap: So because we do know that Emily died in the current timeline we’re in, is it fair to assume whoever is down there with this iteration of the Man in Black is similar to Dolores training Bernard? That has to be a Host or some other something if this is in the future and Emily died. Yes?

    Oh yes, the Katja Herbers in the future talking to the Man in Black is now a Host version of Katja Herbers.
     
  2. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
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    At least that's what I sort of thought was happening more or less. Still nothing about Stubbs though! Cmon Nolan!
     
  3. Lawnole23

    Lawnole23 FSU Seminoles 2020 National Champions
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    They wasted Delores this season. Her character was one-note the entire season. She went from one of the most interesting characters to me being bored when she is on the screen.

    What makes shows like this great are the characters. When they are complex you get hooked. Bernard/Maeve/MIB at times. They got away from this to be more confusing.

    Also, what was the point of the Ghost Nation episode? it was great character development but they had almost no important on what happened in the end.
     
  4. Babou

    Babou ocelot
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  5. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
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    I thought monotone, souless delores was cool when I was guessing that she wasn't really sentient and still running Ford's program. The minute they said she was sentient, she became a lame troupe.
     
  6. LeonardWashington

    LeonardWashington every year gon be our year
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    Stubbs was the one I was mainly talking about...there is pretty much no reason whatsoever for his actions....
     
  7. Fire Jimbob

    Fire Jimbob #1 Alex Caruso Stan
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  8. Lawnole23

    Lawnole23 FSU Seminoles 2020 National Champions
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    Hey this robot that wants to murder all humans, we should let her pass because reasons.
     
  9. Fire Jimbob

    Fire Jimbob #1 Alex Caruso Stan
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    what if he is a bot
     
  10. Fire Jimbob

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    his main objective given by Ford was to take care of all the hosts...
     
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  11. Lawnole23

    Lawnole23 FSU Seminoles 2020 National Champions
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    I think Stubbs is human but hates all the humans so is protecting Dolores.
     
  12. Nick Rivers

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    That's what I inferred from that scene.
     
  13. Fire Jimbob

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    this could be true as well
     
  14. Nick Rivers

    Nick Rivers Well-Known Member
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    From Babou's link:

    "TheWrap: When Halores left the beach, it seemed like Stubbs knew it was Dolores — or at least that it wasn’t Hale. Is that safe to assume?

    Joy: Yes! It is safe to assume. And there is a step further that you can assume too. And we don’t say it explicitly, but if you are left wondering with all [Stubbs’] talk, his knowing talk about, “I’ve been at the park a very long time,” and Ford designed him with certain core drives, and he’s gonna stick to the role he’s been programmed with; it’s a little acknowledgement of just why he might have his suspicions about what’s going on with Hale, and then lets her pass.

    And doesn’t it make sense if you are Ford and designing a park and you have a whole master plan about helping robots that you would keep one Host hiding in plain sight as a fail-safe? Maybe the Host who’s in charge of quality assurance? And by the way, that was totally meant to be subtle [laughs]."
     
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  15. Larry Sura

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    I enjoyed this season and the finale. The post credits scene blew my mind, I can’t wait to see how far in the future that takes place.
     
  16. RSK

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    I enjoyed the conclusion, where we actually ended up, but the journey of it all(which is the essence of the show) to get there was an absolute chore. They added so many unnecessary scenes and confusion for the sake of confusion just for an attempt to be mysterious. The ghost nation/samurai/fort battle episodes for example served very little purpose and just sort of felt like hey we need a samurai episode or hey lets make a native american episode. Then you add in Bernards constant state of confusion that paid off with a "oh I confused myself on purpose" explanation that is just both equal parts unnecessary and confusing again.

    They knew where they wanted to go (Delores and Bernard in the real world) but took forever to get there and lost tons of viewers in the process. The finale should have been the midpoint of the season for it to have been the show most wanted. Instead we had to sit through filler and confusing scenes under the guise of "mystery" to end up at a rather predictable result.
     
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  17. wolfpck

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    I enjoyed it as well. I can't really argue with some of the points against this season, but I liked it a lot. It was ultra confusing and probably to a fault, but I enjoy the mystery box aspect of it :idk:
     
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  18. Juicy Locke

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    I really am intrigued with the whole human immortality storyline, maybe more so than anything else the show has going. So after I somewhat understood that post credits scene, I was excited about it. But then I see an interview where Lisa Joy says it will not be a major storyline in season 3. That’s disappointing and I’m left wondering if that’s the case, why even put that in the episode?
     
  19. joey jo-jo jr shabadoo

    joey jo-jo jr shabadoo you know for me, the action is the juice

    as has been mentioned elsewhere, there aren't really any characters to give a shit about

    they are obviously capable of doing great character work, as "kiksuya" demonstrated, but unfortunately they did a piss poor job of doing it the rest of the season
     
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  20. The Walrus

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    To fuck with the audience, because that seems to be all showrunners care about anymore.

    I really enjoy the world of this show, the stable of talented actors they've assembled, and some of the moral questions it raises, but I wish they could just tell a solid story that isn't intentionally obtuse. The show is capable of so much more than it showed the majority of this season.
     
  21. CaneKnight

    CaneKnight Well-Known Member
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    DA FUCK DID I JUST WATCH?
     
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  22. Jeffrey Lebowski

    Jeffrey Lebowski Obviously you're not a golfer
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  23. Doc Louis

    Doc Louis Well-Known Member
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    Agree, if they'd just told the story without trying to be more confusing it would've been so much more enjoyable. There will probably be some great fanedits come out of it.
     
  24. BellottiBold

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    I can't tell - is she joking here? Because that shit wasn't subtle in the slightest :twocents:
     
  25. TLAU

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    Give us a less vague idea of wtf was in the valley beyond
    Show the audience that hosts can become conscious without having a voice installed in their head
    Introduce us to the people who were gonna take the host’s to the promised land

    The last one is pretty big in the grand scheme of the story, even though on screen it didn’t really have the pizzazz I bet the writers were hoping for... over the top biblical references don’t normally. Lost finale was another example.
     
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  26. marcus

    marcus Sex with old ladies for money aaaand bear traps.
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    The LOST finale was the best and anyone who disagrees removed their own ribs so they can blow themselves.
     
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  27. BellottiBold

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    Wouldn't know because the show was so bad prior to it, I didn't bother watching :awesomeface:
     
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  28. TLAU

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    Rewatched the Finale and definitely felt Lost-ish. Will watch S3e1 and hope for the best but not gonna be excited for it and probably be out unless it’s really intriguing. Way to go HBO
     
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  29. Vito Corleone

    Vito Corleone deluxe member
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    That finale was written by sam Harris or someone like that after going on a weeklong psychedelic retreat
     
  30. Jeffrey Lebowski

    Jeffrey Lebowski Obviously you're not a golfer
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  31. southlick

    southlick "Better Than You"
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  32. Tiffin

    Tiffin “Only time can give you mayonnaise.”
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    I was pretty into the whole season but after watching the finale last night I feel like it was a major letdown. A lot of building for really not much payoff. Honestly would be fine with them calling it there, because I don't care to see the hosts in the real world. I would have been, but not anymore really. Shit was wack.
     
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  33. al1

    al1 Well-Known Member
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    Sorry the selfish writer (Simon Quarterman) to suddenly give up his life to give others more time makes no sense and is not a complete character arc. It's just a lazy opportunity to produce emotion.

    I'm still going to watch bc I straight love the premise.
     
  34. cutig

    cutig My name is Rod, and I like to party
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    Need to watch the entire season again after that ending. Had a feeling a lot of the Bernard scenes were on a different timeline but couldn’t quote piece it together because I kinda felt like I had to be in the mood to really watch and pay attention this season, unlike the last. Didn’t watch weekly. Lots of skipping in the around with no real explanation. I really liked the episode with the natives and samurais though. Too bad they didn’t necessarily tie into the story in a big at, but they were very well done. Especially the natives. Him waking up without tampering was very well done, but it’s a shame they couldn’t really pull that thread any further.

    I really enjoyed it in the end, will definitely tune in for next season. The whole post credit scene is mind fucking. Were the scenes with old Mcpoyle all just a simulation? I do hope they don’t do anything with the hosts in NYC. That would lose me quickly.
     
  35. al1

    al1 Well-Known Member
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    If they would give every major character the Kiksuya treatment, it would be the best show on TV.
     
  36. al1

    al1 Well-Known Member
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    Also casting Floki from Vikings was useless.
     
  37. Fire Jimbob

    Fire Jimbob #1 Alex Caruso Stan
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    he clearly had some second thoughts on what he has done after he saw what they did to Maeve
     
  38. fsuNizz

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    Stubs is a host
    Finale was fantastic, ghost nation created emotion for the Valley and when they crossed over.

    Lost credit scenes were amazing and I look forward to the new “world” Sadly I think the William storyline will be involved yet stale. I want to know for 100% certainty the daughter he shot was his actual daughter
     
  39. Yanks711

    Yanks711 TMB's Hoosier
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    The producer said as much in an interview
     
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  40. fsuNizz

    fsuNizz /nizzbrag
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    Missed it
     
  41. Fargin' Icehole

    Fargin' Icehole 50% soulless
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    Enjoyed it and the season a lot. Wasn't flawless as has been pointed out but it didn't cheat. Was smart and every scene seemed to have purpose.
     
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  42. Fargin' Icehole

    Fargin' Icehole 50% soulless
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    Thinking back on it, Bernard was rebuilt by Delores at Arnold's house right? But he didn't die, so is there another Bernard still in the park. I know I have to be misremembering something.....

    *Shot by Delores/Charlotte. I just can't remember that.
     
    #3242 Fargin' Icehole, Jul 8, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
  43. bic

    bic the way out is through
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    After Dolores/Charlotte revealed herself and took everyone else out she told Bernard she wouldn't have needed a second chance if he hadn't killer her in the first place and also said Ford knew they'd never make it out as themselves. I took that to mean that they needed someone like Dolores in Charlotte's body to have a chance to get out. So she killed him and takes his mind with her in the bag. It's also possible she didn't take his mind and reprogrammed him again as she did for Ford in the park since she knew Arnold best but that would have taken a lot longer so I'm going to go with she took his mind ball thing.
     
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  44. Fargin' Icehole

    Fargin' Icehole 50% soulless
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    Just rewatched it. Didn't stick with me I because it just shows the gun go off, and then the next scene is Bernard on the beach in the earlier timeline.
     
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  45. bic

    bic the way out is through
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    Yeah, there was a lot of confusing just for the sake of confusing that I didn't love this season. I like where it ended up and am interested to see what they do moving forward but there was a lot of stuff this season that just seemed unnecessarily confusing. We probably should have expected that since it's Jonathan Nolan. Thinking of some of the movies he's written and how he likes to tell stories out of order... imagine a movie like Memento or The Prestige stretched out to 10+ hours. It's likely to get a little silly.
     
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  46. Jack Parkman

    Jack Parkman Well-Known Member
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  47. nexus

    nexus Paradise Found
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    Methworld imo
     
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  48. allothersnsused

    allothersnsused Wow that’s crazy
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    Science, bitch!
     
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  49. PAHokie

    PAHokie Can't a bitch living say I bought her Michael Kors
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    Finally got around to watching season 2. I have no idea what the hell happened.
     
  50. Jack Parkman

    Jack Parkman Well-Known Member
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    [​IMG]
     
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