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Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by Nantucket, Jan 29, 2017.
Guy with vested interest pumps vested interest amplified by other guy with same vested interest.
CEO of world's largest asset manager makes very pro-bitcoin comments (echoing what btc people have been saying for a decade+) after making negative and dismissive comments a few years ago.
That guy is one of the lizard people beware
I enjoy the idea that these CEOs are all knowing and definitely don't routinely lead the economy into calamity.
As exciting as it feels for crypto right now, I would not trust a single word out of Finks mouth.
You should call him and tell him it has no intrinsic value.
Rat Poison squared brother
I'm obviously pro bitcoin but I'll never be as bullish on it going forward as I once was. I believe it's digital gold but ask wealth advisors what they think about actual gold and you'll have your answer as to why. As the cycles continue to play out it will go higher but the returns compared to previous cycles will be less and less. I'll be denominating in ETH and going in heavy on newer projects and things like Sol that have a lot of developers doing cool shit. If I wanted to get euphoric over a 2 or 3x I'd play the stock market.
And before user pops in w/ the total market cap of gold vs BTC, while it may happen eventually it's certainly not going to happen in the next 2 years. I'd like to be retired before that plays out over the next 50 years.
This is a good post.
I’d like to think it gets to the gold market cap much faster and has a total addressable market that’s far higher, but to each his own. I don’t begrudge anyone who has a thesis and has their own money on it.
I think btc’s thesis is boring…”get rich slow” or “don’t get poor” kind of deal. I have no time to pick stocks or other what I consider to be risky investments.
This sounds a lot like gold bug talk and those people are totally sane.
Imagine converting your entire company and net worth into Bitcoin and not understanding this chart. Just a random walk bro. Could go up, could go down.
Just a big ole lib talking crypto. Good to see common sense prevailing.
Any positive ruling on the shittiest shit coin that ever lived is a victory. Of course there will be dissenting viewpoints but it was definitely a W for the tokens doing it right and furthermore just proves the point that this stuff doesn’t fit in the box of an orange farm test and needs it’s own set of rules.
As of August 16, 2023, you have a withdrawable balance that has an approximate USD value of less than $1.
Get fucked Gary
all my apes. gone.
I tried to pay $10 for a 3% chance at a “rare” Steph curry basketball gif yesterday. The top shot app did not work for me though
Even most crypto people have been saying this since day one. Not exactly ground breaking stuff except to the true jpeg believers.
This is from May of last year... going in circles about the same convo from a year ago.
In at least 12 states, including Arkansas, Ohio, Oklahoma, Tennessee, Texas and Wyoming, The Times identified Chinese-owned or -operated Bitcoin mines that together use as much energy as 1.5 million homes. At full capacity, the Cheyenne, Wyo., mine alone would require enough electricity to power 55,000 houses.
1. Bitcoin Energy Utilization: Bitcoin runs on stranded, excess energy, generated at the edge of the grid, in places where there is no other demand, at times when no one else needs the electricity. Retail & commercial consumers of electricity in major population areas pay 5-10x more per kwH (10-20 cents per kwH) than bitcoin miners, who should be thought of as wholesale consumers of energy (normally budgeting 2-3 cents per kwH). The world produces more energy than it needs, and approximately a third of this energy is wasted. The last 15 basis points of energy power the entire Bitcoin Network - this is the least valued, cheapest margin of energy left after 99.85% of the energy in the world is allocated to other uses.
2. Bitcoin vs. Other Industries: Bitcoin mining is the most efficient, cleanest industrial use of electricity, and is improving its energy efficiency at the fastest rate across any major industry. Our metrics show ~59.5% of energy for bitcoin mining comes from sustainable sources and energy efficiency improved 46% YoY. No other industry comes close (consider planes, trains, automobiles, healthcare, banking, construction, precious metals, etc.). The bitcoin network keeps getting more energy efficient because of the relentless improvement in the semiconductors (SHA-256 ASICs) that power the bitcoin mining centers, combined with the halving of bitcoin mining rewards every four years that is built into the protocol. This results in a consistent 18-36% improvement year after year in energy efficiency. More details on this are included in the BMC Presentation.
3. Bitcoin Value Creation & Energy Intensity: Approximately $4-5 billion in electricity is used to power & secure a network that is worth $420 billion as of today, and settles $12 billion per day ($4 trillion per year). The value of the output is 100x the cost of the energy input. This makes Bitcoin far less energy intensive than Google, Netflix, or Facebook, and 1-2 orders of magnitude less energy intensive than traditional 20th century industries like airlines, logistics, retail, hospitality, & agriculture.
4. Bitcoin vs. Other Cryptos: The only proven technique for creating a digital commodity is Proof of Work (bitcoin mining) deployed in a fair, equitable fashion (i.e. no pre-mine, no ICO, no controlling foundation, no primary software development team, no series of forced hard fork upgrades that materially change the monetary protocol). If we remove the dedicated hardware (SHA-256 ASICs) and the dedicated energy that powers those mining rigs, we are left with a network secured by proprietary software running on generic computers. That places all security & control of the network in the hands of a small group of software developers, who must create virtual machines doing virtual work with virtual energy in a virtual world to create virtual security. All attempts to date have resulted in a digital asset that meets the definition of an investment contract (i.e. digital security, not digital commodity). They all pass the Howie test and therefore look more like equities than commodities.
Regulators & legal experts have noted on many occasions that Proof of Stake networks are likely securities, not commodities, and we can expect them to be treated as such over time. PoS Crypto Securities may be appropriate for certain applications, but they are not suitable to serve as global, open, fair money or a global open settlement network. Therefore, it makes no sense to compare Proof of Stake networks to Bitcoin. The creation of a digital commodity without an issuer that serves as “digital gold” is an innovation (we have accomplished this only once in the history of the world with Bitcoin). The creation of a digital security or digital coupon on a shared database is utterly ordinary (it has been done 20,000 times in the crypto world, and 100,000+ times in the traditional world).
5. Bitcoin & Carbon Emissions: 99.92% of carbon emissions in the world are due to industrial uses of energy other than bitcoin mining. Bitcoin mining is neither the problem nor the solution to the challenge of reducing carbon emissions. It is in fact a rounding error and would hardly be noticed if it were not for the competitive guerrilla marketing activities of other crypto promoters & lobbyists that seek to focus negative attention on Proof of Work mining in order to distract regulators, politicians, & the general public from the inconvenient truth that Proof of Stake crypto assets are generally unregistered securities trading on unregulated exchanges to the detriment of the retail investing public.
6. Bitcoin & Environmental Benefits: There is an increasing awareness that Bitcoin is quite beneficial to the environment because it can be deployed to monetize stranded natural gas or methane gas energy sources. Methane gas emissions' curtailment is particularly compelling and Dan Batten (https://batcoinz.com/) has written some impressive papers on this subject. It has also become clear that energy grids that rely primarily on sustainable power sources like wind, hydro, & solar can be unreliable at times due to lack of water, sunlight, or wind. In this case, they need to be paired with a large, flexible electricity consumer like a bitcoin miner in order to develop grid resilience & finance the buildout of additional capacity necessary to responsibly power major industrial/population centers. The recent example of major Bitcoin energy curtailment on the ERCOT grid in Texas is an example of the benefits of bitcoin mining to sustainable power providers. No other industrial energy consumer is so well suited to monetize excess power as well as curtail flexibly during periods of energy shortfall & production volatility.
7. Bitcoin & Global Energy: Bitcoin maximalists believe that Bitcoin is an instrument of economic empowerment for 8 billion people around the world. This is supported by the ability of a bitcoin miner to monetize any power source, anywhere, anytime, at any scale. Bitcoin mining can bring a clean, profitable and modern industry that generates hard currency to a remote location in the developing world, connected only via satellite link. All that is needed is some excess electricity generated from a waterfall, geothermal source, or miscellaneous excess energy deposit. Google, Netflix, and Apple won’t be setting up data centers in Central Africa that export services to their wealthy western clients anytime soon due to constraints on bandwidth, privacy, & requirements for consistent power flow, but bitcoin miners are not hampered by these constraints. They can utilize erratic power supplies with low bandwidth in remote locations and generate valuable bitcoin without prejudice, just as if they were in a suburb of NYC, LA, or SF. Even now, Bitcoin miners are everywhere and will continue to spread (though Africa, Asia, South America, etc.) wherever there is excess energy and anyone with aspirations for a better life. Bitcoin is an egalitarian financial asset offering financial inclusion to all, and bitcoin mining is an egalitarian technology industry offering commercial inclusion to anyone with the energy & engineering capability to operate a mining center.
I keep waiting for people to realize that A.I. uses a lot of energy as well. Seems to have been left out of the narrative so far.
I denounce AI
Really surprised the bump wasn't about being able to buy Taylor Swift tickets with Bitcoin
Can we get some articles on how much energy the Taylor Swift Eras Tour has used?
I can provide incorrect information or we can wait for user to post the long cat version
It's like a choose-your-own-adventure book
Possibly to allow them to appeal quicker without having to waste time at the trial fwiw.
Pretty wild that if you started dca'ing at the worst possible time, then you'd be up 20+% on the investment. Spot etf approval seems inevitable. Next few years should be fun.
Halving + ETF = number go up
My bags are packed
Mine too, it's all Sol though