Official Investing Thread

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by Joe Louis, Jul 12, 2010.

  1. Stagger Lee

    Stagger Lee Crazy. Sexy. Cool.
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    I can't imagine the market actually expected the House bill to pass. I guess the issue is Trump has terminated all negotiations.
     
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  2. pacey

    pacey Well-Known Member
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    I hope he catches COVID
     
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  3. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    I mean they probably thought the electoral benefit would push Trump into doing it since he's getting annihilated in the race.
     
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  4. HuskerGuy99

    HuskerGuy99 Above Average Member

    Back-to-back 6M+ volume candles on SPY 5-minute chart. Probably has not happened outside the first/last 10 minutes of trade since March/April. If 335 goes, we will be at 330 quick and most likely 326.5 by tomorrow.
     
  5. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    They've been low key setting the table for this for months so shit going to get dark in the short term, and Dems need to get the Senate or Republicans will continue burning it down
     
  6. Gritty Badger

    Gritty Badger Well-Known Member
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    What's the most popular thing I can do to help my re-election chances? Ok, do the opposite. -DTJ
     
  7. HuskerGuy99

    HuskerGuy99 Above Average Member

    Crypto dump coming as well thanks to this massive move.
     
  8. ohhaithur

    ohhaithur e-Batman
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    "Elect me and I'll pass the bill my opponent wants"

    I can't believe there are morons who eat this shit up
     
  9. BP

    BP Bout to Regulate.
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    I just don't see them giving up no matter how far Trump is behind, especially when election shenanigans that will go on.
     
  10. Fusiontegra

    Fusiontegra My life is dope and I do dope shit.#SparedByThanos
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    That's not what he said. He said he's pass A bill that focused on...

    What his definition of "focuses on" is quite different than yours and mine imo
     
  11. billdozer

    billdozer Well-Known Member
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  12. Fusiontegra

    Fusiontegra My life is dope and I do dope shit.#SparedByThanos
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    They're not wrong...but also can do zero about it for 3 more months.
     
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  13. NothingIsOT

    NothingIsOT Always down for the Kroger parking lot!
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    I got to think Facebook is the play here. All those parts have to be worth more separate than together at this point.
     
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  14. brolift

    brolift Well-Known Member
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    Bad bet. They’re not soft bank lol.
     
  15. brolift

    brolift Well-Known Member
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    Very glad I only invest and have put trading behind me
     
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  16. NothingIsOT

    NothingIsOT Always down for the Kroger parking lot!
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    I don’t follow.

    They got a massive platform in WhatsApp that makes them $0.
     
  17. brolift

    brolift Well-Known Member
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    It’s priced in. They def make money in WhatsApp integrating ads in fb/ig to work w WA. Billions of users.

    I mean like SoftBank assets individually are worth more than SoftBank because masayoshi is a scamming retard.
     
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  18. ned's head

    ned's head Well-Known Member

    Submitted a 401k distribution to roll into my new employer's plan yesterday. Thanks for everything, President T.
     
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  19. Stagger Lee

    Stagger Lee Crazy. Sexy. Cool.
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    My two biggest holdings by far are AAPL and AMZN. Now I need to decide whether to dump and wait for this political nonsense to settle down.
     
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  20. Sportfan

    Sportfan From Six to Dumptime

    Why would you unless they weren’t long term plays? When would you know to get back in, if in fact they do fall.
     
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  21. NineteenNine

    NineteenNine Divers are, in fact, wankers. It's science.
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    Anyone here have any experience with investing in Opportunity Zones?
     
  22. southside

    southside Well-Known Member
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    No but I’m looking at it atm
     
  23. burnttatertot

    burnttatertot (๏̯๏)
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    If you're in that zone, opportunity awaits. What more could you possibly need to know?
     
  24. Doc Louis

    Doc Louis Well-Known Member
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    No, but they could have been working with different scenarios base on probabilities that some sections of the house and Senate versions (or whatever Republicans were talking up) passed.
     
  25. Gotch Yarbrough

    Gotch Yarbrough Canada eh?
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    Oranjello is this one of your areas of expertise? I seem to recall you talking about setting up a fund of some sort but don't recall the specifics.
     
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  26. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    Tons
     
  27. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    Good memory. Yeah, I setup and structure investment funds for a living, and I’ve spent more time than I’d like to admit with opportunity zones.

    AMA
     
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  28. construxboy

    construxboy xenForo is the new TMB
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    Just remember looking at it briefly and there were more hoops to jump through than I would have thought. Never did it.
     
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  29. NineteenNine

    NineteenNine Divers are, in fact, wankers. It's science.
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    Ok, quick scenario. I have a property I want to sell, that we have >$1million in equity in. I've id'd a building I'd like to buy with the proceeds from that sell that's in an OZ. (can't do a 1031 because the building price would be lower and we wouldn't have as much leverage on it). So I sell building one and have $1MM in cash ready to buy building 2. Now what do I do?
     
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  30. Doug

    Doug Skeptical Doug-o
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    We're in the process right now, have read a little bit but going to rely heavily on our CPA.
     
  31. gordon bombay

    gordon bombay magician's alliance enthusiast
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    FSLY good god
     
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  32. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    First, you should hire a competent attorney familiar with OZs to setup the qualified opportunity fund and a subsidiary of that fund (with the proper language in both operating agreements). Once the fund is setup and within ~180 days (depending on how building 1 was owned prior to sale) of selling the first building, you (the investor) then invest the $1m in the fund. The tax benefits are tied to the investor's investment in the QOF. The QOF/fund then contributes the $1m to its subsidiary, and the subsidiary buys building 2. Thereafter, building 2 will have to be "substantially improved," which generally requires you to make investments in the building that double your investment in building 2 (there are other factors that can be taken into account in determining whether this requirement can be met aside from making capital improvements).

    So in your situation, without raising additional capital you would, for example, buy a building worth $450k sitting on $50k worth of land -- you would satisfy the test by spending $451k ($1k more than its cost basis of $450k) on improvements to the building. There are lots of other hoops to jump through, especially with respect to post-acquisition operations, but that's the gist of how the initial purchase plays out. The hoops are much more difficult for operating bossinesses to meet than real estate owners, though.
     
  33. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    We recommend to all of our clients that they hire a competent CPA to help them with ongoing compliance of these things, as there are lots of numerical tests that if they are not satisfied then you will pay penalties. You don't determine if the tests are met until return filing season, so a competent CPA that you meet with a few times a year to run the numbers is very important.

    I also recommend thoroughly vetting your CPA, as i've seen lots of CPAs who want to learn about these things but when it comes down to it they don't know anything at all. I actually had to prepare my first ever tax return for a client on 9/14 this year because the guy was all talk and couldn't figure it out
     
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  34. NineteenNine

    NineteenNine Divers are, in fact, wankers. It's science.
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    Follow ups: so you need to invest as much in the building as the purchase price to qualify here? ($1millon purchase price = $1million capital improvements?)

    And running a business in the zone is a complete PITA?
     
  35. Doug

    Doug Skeptical Doug-o
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    Yeah... I'm going to need a follow up call with our CPA. Won't change our plans to buy the building, but I doubt we can meet that "substantially improved" threshold.
     
  36. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    For the most part, yes. You should hire knowledgeable attorneys and CPAs to hold your hand through the setup process, otherwise you'll most likely run into some traps that will cost you money down the line.

    Keep in mind, it is a place-based economic development incentive, so you get tax benefits in exchange for investing in a low income area. For property (land and buildings) already in existence, then you have to make investments fixing up the place that double the purchase price of the building in order to qualify for those incentives--which can be lucrative. If you buy raw land, then you have to purchase property (including construction materials) to bring into the area to run the business.

    Running a business isn't impossible, it just depends on the type of business. Because there are a number of tests tied to the physical location within the qualified opportunity zone (for example, the building or the place of business located in the zone), things can get complicated when the business earns money outside of a QOZ. Think a service type business that sends workers to other parts of the city; internet based sales aren't really an issue if the operations generally take place within the QOZ. That is less of a concern when you own a building and rent it out, for example, since all of the income is generated from that particular tract of land.

    These are all general statements of course, as the ~190 pages of rules have lots of nuances.
     
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  37. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    There are work arounds, but you may want to speak with an attorney to help you plan for those work arounds rather than a CPA. Both are valuable partners for different reasons :twocents:
     
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  38. NineteenNine

    NineteenNine Divers are, in fact, wankers. It's science.
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    Oh, if this goes bad for me, have no doubt that I'm coming after u/Oranjello of the mainboard dot com for damages.

    re: business -- what I'm looking at would be converting a building into a hotel/airbnb short term rental situation, so the income would all come from the land.
     
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  39. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    Ask your CPA to analyze whether the planned business will be a "trade or business," among other things. Depending on your level involvement in managing it, there may or may not be some hoops for you (you being the QOF subsidiary) to jump through

    Edit: For a hotel/Airbnb you are most likely fine, but if you convert to condos or triple net lease it there is additional planning required
     
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  40. NineteenNine

    NineteenNine Divers are, in fact, wankers. It's science.
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    awesome. thanks for the help!
     
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  41. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    Just noticed your fan of section. Let me know if you need a referral in NOLA. I know some great tax guys there that are well qualified to help from both a tax law and tax accounting perspective
     
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  42. Doug

    Doug Skeptical Doug-o
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    If you don't mind PM me your guys info and I'll bring it to our group and see if they want to use them or keep going with our current guy. He's generally great, but in our talks he didn't mention what you have here so he may not really know.
     
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  43. NineteenNine

    NineteenNine Divers are, in fact, wankers. It's science.
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    Quick follow up: does the income generated off of the business have to be reinvested into the QOF or can that be treated as regular income?
     
  44. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    The latter
     
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  45. HuskerGuy99

    HuskerGuy99 Above Average Member

    Who was it that posted that NVDA chart a few weeks back when it was consolidating? Look at PEP today on 5 min chart WTF. Of all the days it picks to do this.
     
  46. Fusiontegra

    Fusiontegra My life is dope and I do dope shit.#SparedByThanos
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    That was me. It broke out that day; guess I'll be watching PEP at about 136.2 for the day.
     
  47. NineteenNine

    NineteenNine Divers are, in fact, wankers. It's science.
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    Follow up to the follow up: is there a timeframe for the investment into the property to be done? ie if I buy the building for a million, how long do I have to do the million in improvements?
     
  48. Fusiontegra

    Fusiontegra My life is dope and I do dope shit.#SparedByThanos
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    Broke out and moving.
     
  49. Oranjello

    Oranjello Well-Known Member
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    There are numerous timing requirements that must be met, and they all have variations/nuances depending on the circumstances. Generally, you have 180 days to invest in the QOF, which then has another 180 days to push the funds down to the subsidiary, which then has 30 months to make the improvements.** The kicker is that there is ambiguity in the regs, and a good advisor will tell you that, under certain circumstances, the 30 month substantial improvement period can begin whenever you want it to. Complicating things further is COVID-19 relief that relaxes these rules for certain timing requirements ending in 2020.

    **The subsidiary can invoke the "working capital safe harbor" that alters the timing requirements at the QOF subsidiary level by an additional 30 months if certain criteria are met.

    These are some pretty complicated rules that have dozens of traps for the unwary, so I can't stress enough how important it is to have a good advisor holding your hand through them all. I have numerous clients who think they "get it" and despite my warnings I fully expect them to be subject to penalty at some point. In fact, I actually just got an email from an OZ client who received a penalty letter dated October 5th due to their CPA's fuckup
     
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  50. HuskerGuy99

    HuskerGuy99 Above Average Member

    Yep thank god. Held that way longer than I wanted to. Pulled 20% and maybe could have squeezed another 20% out here we will see if it hits 137.50 today. Was watching QQQ go up and PEP is just sitting there all morning long.

    Well looks like I sold right as the rest of the market decided to fire up lol.
     
    #20900 HuskerGuy99, Oct 7, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2020
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