his follow-up tweets from what i understand, russia can export gas through poland or ukraine exclusively now with nord stream dead.
Would have a tough time taking tweets by Mr. Sikorski seriously after he appeared to participate in a coordinated Russian propaganda campaign immediately after the explosions.
Idk what to make of all this chatter about nukes recently. Wonder if Russia blew the nordstreams to blame the west and continue to build their justification for using nukes…(another being the sham referendums held in occupied lands setting up annexation).
That is a level of resolve I do not want tested. I think even China would cut loose if they went to that.
Tucker best keep away from staircases and open windows onces he inevitably runs afoul of Putin's talking points by sheer mistake.
Gives you cannon fodder that any untrained rabble gets you but doesn't also kill off the working/reproducing members of an already falling population.
How do people feel about these conscripts? On one hand they human beings who are going to war against their wishes. Many will die and most if not all have no desire to kill a Ukrainian. On the other as a population they’ve stood by while Putin has run roughshod over the country. Few were willing to stand up to his regime… so here is your big bowl of consequences. In the end if you are on Ukrainian soil with a weapon you are fair game.
I mean, not great. I'm not a huge fan of kill-cam videos in general because typically you're seeing 1) a 19 year old who joined the Army for some misplaced patriotic zeal/trying to escape a bad situation through one of the only means available in this broken world or 2) a conscript who joined the army because they lost the lottery. High ranking officers get blown up, fine, they have enough info and experience to know what they're in for. ETA: its easy to say "they should fight against Putin," but that's hard enough to do in a Western country with police militarization and failing democratic practices. Harder to do in Russia where that tradition is a lot more ingrained.
I think I feel mostly like you do. It’s fucking shitty. I’m sure many of these guys were rocking Z shirts and talking tough a few months back. But that is far from universal. At the Russian company I left last year though Everyone opposed the war but didn’t think they could do anything that mattered. Elections don’t matter. The company had been moving all of the employees out of Russia for awhile out of worries for this.
I think it’s worthwhile to consider what you’d do in that situation, especially if you have a family or people who depend on you. Sure there are chuds getting their comeuppance in the mix, but you have to figure lots of these are just average people trying to live their lives and unfortunately live under one of the most heartless and brutal and corrupt authoritarian regimes in the world today. “Standing up” to Putin gets you disappeared, and these people know that. It’s a real catch 22 and I would not be quick to judge them. Now, the oligarchs and those who *could* conceivably do something about this, they are fair game.
Pretty easy to say that from 5,000 miles away IMO. A lot of comments about “the Russian people need to do something” like that hasn’t turned into a massacre of the people just about every time the last 250 years or more.
It’s not like Putin instantly took control in a coup and they’re just too shocked to stop it. His current level of power was built over two decades; step-by-step erasing the (poorly and hastily built) safeguards to prevent dictatorship in post-Soviet Russia. This was done with the complicity and cooperation of the existing government and the populace, all because Russians always have, and probably always will, 1. Love strongmen tyrants 2. Put the state before themselves It’s why Trump loves him, and why we must zealously defend against falling prey to these ideals ourselves.
Sure, but you’re talking about posting on message boards and speaking plainly to your friends and family. Those things alone in Russia could get you disappeared, let along doing something like demonstrating, and not to speak of engaging in some activity that actually threatens the government.
they’re going to flood luhansk and Donetsk with Russians then say if ukraine attacks they are attacking Russia so nuclear weapons are in play. They aren’t trying to field an effective fighting force. That and they hope if they put enough bodies in the way it’ll buy them time until winter and winter will save them
They do now because Putin’s hold is secured. I’m talking about 20 years ago when he first started rising to prominence and the cogs began turning that essentially gave him unlimited wealth and power; those were surrendered by somebody, he didn’t automatically acquire them.
So you think farmer Boris surrendered his vast wealth and power to Putin? If you’re looking for culprits, you need to be looking up the food chain, IMO. And I’m not here to defend Russians or Russia generally, but this is human tragedy on many levels, and the average Russian person has been treated like garbage by their rulers and conquerors for so many hundreds of years that I just don’t think it’s fair to point them as being responsible for the present situation.
Yeah, that’s fair. I don’t really want to victim-blame, but I guess I did. It’s absolutely an ingrained mindset to serfdom.
What we can agree on here for sure is that if you need any examples to remind whether it is worth personal sacrifice in order to prevent fascist authoritarian regimes from ever taking hold, this is just another example. But our society is one that has the luxury of choice in that regard; not all societies do.
Look at the leaders that would have been in charge 20 years ago. They had no spine. Look at the US. The leaders in charge 20 years ago fucked over future generations. I don't think it's in many of them to make correct decisions for future generations.
Russians have had the worst luck with leadership for at least 200 years now. 1) Totalitarian Monarchy - Revolution 2) Totalitarian Monarchy plus Capitalism - Revolution - Civil War between pretty cool anarchists, pretty cool socialists, less bad communists, and more bad communists 3) More Bad Communist Totalitarianism - Collapse 4) Capitalist oligarchy 5) Totalitarian Capitalist Oligarchy
Sounds like their volunteer army is relatively similar to ours in this way: it’s a way for poor people to try to improve their station in life. For a lot of them one of the only ways. I pretty much feel sorry for everyone dying in ukraine other than the senior officers. Only a few people wanted this war and like 200,000,000+ people are being impacted. And im not sure this ends even if putin dies. Just awful
It ends seconds after putin dies because the oligarchs desperately want their yachts and private jets back. Hopefully a clever oligarch seizes control and gulags the ultranationalists and remnants of the putin regime.
Absolutely the rise up against Putin would have been an almost impossible task. You’d have to have a whole generation willing to sacrifice itself. But it has been done before. Revolutions can still happen. It will have to come from within at the highest levels. Ukrainian people feel little sympathy for the common Russian in relation to their dictator; they’ll tell you they overthrew theirs. Yes it’s a different scale and the gov apparatus is not comparable.
I start there but these war crimes and worse aren’t just senior officers. No matter how or why you get there at the end you are responsible for your own behavior. Once you cross that line catching an armed IED dropped by a drone you never saw sucks, but my sympathies wane.
What’s insane to think about in hypothetical alt futures is if Trump wins in 2020, American soldiers are boots on the ground in Ukraine fighting for Russia.
I think they are acting the same that 99 percent of the human population would act. Preserving their life and their families life. Also, like 80 percent of Russia has no access to the outside world and dont know any better.