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Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by Jake Barnes, Jan 22, 2020.
You can take the word "sustained" out of this post.
He was never an elite player, period.
Trying to take away the Super Bowls as a fluke or something is dumb, they won.
You can acknowledge that he had two great playoff runs that ended in Super Bowl wins and did nothing resembling greatness in the rest of his long career.
Skip Bayless would love this topic of conversation.
Fuck your Skip.
Long career, few pro bowls and some good super bowl wins. He is in, but just by a hair.
I think if he wasn’t Peytons brother people would look at his career a little more positively. Hard to live up to Peytons career
If he wasn't Peyton's brother and played in Jacksonville or another small market he wouldnt have a prayer
The team had a great run, mainly the defense. He wasn't leading the offense to 40 every week in the playoffs.
I doubt either gets in. They don't go 5 and 6 deep per era. There's 26 QB's in from the last 60 years. Only 2 that retired post-2000.
Modern Era: Quarterbacks (26)
Troy Aikman 1989-2000
George Blanda (Also PK) 1949-1958, 1960-1975
Terry Bradshaw 1970-1983
Len Dawson 1957-1975
John Elway 1983-1998
Brett Favre 1991-2010
Dan Fouts 1973-1987
Otto Graham 1946-1955
Bob Griese 1967-1980
Sonny Jurgensen 1957-1974
Jim Kelly 1986-1996
Bobby Layne 1948-1962
Dan Marino 1983-1999
Joe Montana 1979-1994
Warren Moon 1984-2000
Joe Namath 1965-1977
Ken Stabler 1970-1984
Bart Starr 1956-1971
Roger Staubach 1969-1979
Fran Tarkenton 1961-1978
Y.A. Tittle 1948-1964
Johnny Unitas 1956-1973
Norm Van Brocklin 1949-1960
Kurt Warner 1998-2009
Bob Waterfield 1945-1952
Steve Young 1985-1999
the 2011 playoff run was 100% eli. the defense that year was not good.
Phillip Rivers had some amazing offensive weapons around him for a bit. Think Eli’s stats would have been better if he played in SD for sure, but Manning’s thought they were too good for SD I guess
Eli played really well in the 2011 playoffs but the defense gave up 14 ppg and held NE to 17 when their season average was 32 so I don't think it's fair to give him all of the credit
I think a lot of this debate is really around what constitutes a HoF qb. Just my opinion but to get in you should define your generation at the position. Brees, Brady, Peyton and Rodgers meet that threshold imo. Big Ben would be the floor for me from that era in terms of who gets in. Eli, Ryan, Rivers etc are a tier below him so they're out if I'm voting, not that anyone gives a shit
using wins as an individual stat is even more dumb.
eli was never an elite player at his position, but was a part of two great team runs. I do thank him for taking the Pats down twice, but aside that, his 'greatness' is overstated because the media and many fans like to attribute any wins/losses to the QB.
I agree with you on that if we were starting over from scratch and re-evaulating all the QB's who have been let in I dont think he is in but seeing who is in, I dont think you can leave him out. I think Ryan and Rivers compare favorably to Fouts and Moon in QB's who put up tons of stats, made the playoffs but never won a SB.
Tony Romo and Palmer didnt have good enough sustained careers to make it to me especially with no rings.
Relieved to see No has surged and overtaken Yes for now
Yeah, you’re probably right.
Moon was a pioneer and 9x pro bowler (Ryan has 4) though. I think that solidly separates him from a guy like Ryan. Moon defined his generation of QBs in a way Rivers and Ryan never did imo
I'm ok with leaving them out. I think the SB rings is what is getting Eli in. I agree that Rivers and Ryan's numbers dont stand out in comparison to their peers like Moon's did. He and Marino were doing things people werent doing before other than Tarkenton.
Stafford is going to be dealing with the same arguments Ryan and Rivers are in 5-7 years.
Namath and Sonny Jurgensen both had losing records for their careers and are both in the Hall. Eli will definitely get in, but shouldn't be a first ballot guy.
.5 in INT% is like an inch on your nose.
his problem is all the other great QBs who are about to get in. His best bet was retiring first, before Brady/Brees/Rivers/Rodgers/etc., which he has done by at least a year or two.
It's 1 int every 6 games or so (difference between #1 and #5 in the league in 2020 so actually pretty small) and the point is that he doesn't compare all that favorably to a dude who might get dropped by his current team for 2020 and is not anyone's idea of HoF qb
I think it's reasonable to ask if he was ever even the best player on his team
this doesn't seem like a very good qualifier.
Maybe not by itself but in the context of the mountain of interceptions and .500 record I think it's worth thinking about
Exactly Joe Namath shouldn't be in the hall.
Probably not. He had a few good years but not enough. He was an iconic figure and helped grow the league but based on solely numbers he shouldn't be in.
Eli was a mediocre QB for most of his career, has been outright bad for 3-4 years now, and should be nowhere near the HOF
that said, he'll get in
Might as well put Cooper in if Eli gets in.
Led the league in INTs three times
5 seasons at less than 60% completion
never an All-Pro, just 4 Pro Bowls in an age where like 10 QBs make the Pro Bowl ever year
McNabb and Romo should get in before Eli
passer rating is not a perfect measure of a qb by any means, but his career passer rating index is 88. 100 is the NFL average.
but seriously thanks for beating the Pats in the SB twice.
Advanced metrics like DVOA and DYAR have him peaking at 9th and averaging somewhere in the upper teens each year so they're pretty well aligned on his performance
I was thinking about QB stat inflation over the last generation and think this is a decent trivia question.
Don’t cheat. Who threw for more TDs in their college career, Eli Manning or Joe Burrow?
would say Eli just because he played more years
Eli started three seasons and had just 33 attempts as a Freshman.
Burrow had 38 attempts at Ohio State and two seasons at LSU.
Burrow having only 16 TDs his first season at LSU doesn’t seem believable now.
Eli retires as the highest-paid player of all time. That influence on the league should be enough to get him in.
welp obviously this means yes he should be
He’ll get in but he’s not an all time great qb
Is Roethlisberger a HOFer? I thought I remember Mix and others adamantly arguing against it a couple of years ago but could be wrong. I assume he's in.
He doesn't get there per PFR's HOF monitor but he was a more prolific passer than Eli and won super bowls.
Agreed. He absolutely should not be a HoF QB but I dont run the HoF. He will be though.
Sounds like a NYG ring of honor candidate
A record which will be dunked on in a few months.
Does anyone want to know my opinion about this topic?
But what do we do about those pesky super bowl MVP awards?
I don't think he belongs