Venezuela Topic

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by southlick, Feb 23, 2019.

  1. Jay Jay Okocha

    Donor

    What does this have to do with Iraq?

    Seriously?

    History is important but this is College Union dullard posting.

    Venezuala is a spectacular failure because of poor governance. It relied on high oil prices and did as all nationalized industries do, inevitably being run into the ground with a complete failure to build an economy elsewhere. The anti US shit is just that- US companies traded with Venezuala and were heavily relied on by them. The ironic thing about the left who argue for this regime is that it is yet another example of an industry which wrecks the environment- something that the Left will claim to go to bat for when it suits them. When it is the UK coal mines, Venezuala oil or Norwegian sovereign wealth fund build off greenhouse gases they don’t give a fuck.

    Another lovely irony is that almost all right thinking countries and organizations are squarely against this regime. The ones against? South power building China and Russia, the latter of which goes from being the the evil Trump shadow puppets to right thinking when opposing US foreign policy.

    The US are not angels in Venezuala or the region as a whole but this is stupid shit. Running the country into the dirt is because of this regime, that is the reality.
     
  2. Jay Jay Okocha

    Donor

    Anyone ‘member the coup Chavez started in 1992 or does that not count?
     
    leroi likes this.
  3. AIOLICOCK

    AIOLICOCK Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    South Carolina GamecocksAtlanta BravesCarolina PanthersHouston TexansBuffalo Sabres

    Because, as we saw in Iraq, the US military is incapable of benevolent intervention. The US military is the most malignant, destructive, force in human history. They are only capable of making things worse.
     
  4. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor
    Clemson Tigers

    this is too many straw men for one post
     
  5. Frank Martin

    Frank Martin tough love makes better posters
    Donor
    South Carolina GamecocksBaltimore OriolesBaltimore RavensLiverpool

    You think Iraqis are worse off today than they were under Saddam?

    Seriously?
     
  6. AIOLICOCK

    AIOLICOCK Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    South Carolina GamecocksAtlanta BravesCarolina PanthersHouston TexansBuffalo Sabres

    Undoubtedly. Iraq was a modern muslim country. They had a market economy, great universities, and wide access to healthcare. Yes, Saddam was garbage, but nothing the US has done has improved things.
     
  7. Joe_Pesci

    Joe_Pesci How can less be more? It's impossible
    Donor

    Is anyone actually "arguing for this regime" in here? My reading of the posts by people you are most likely referencing but not actually responding to is that Maduro is corrupt but it's not the place of the United States to be deciding who governs Venezuela. And for me personally, U.S. interest in Venezuelan human rights and democracy is particularly conspicuous given the history there and the standards that it holds other countries to.
     
  8. Jay Jay Okocha

    Donor

    The stupidity and ignorance of this post is astounding. That people bring Iraq up because of “history” and then make such historically ignorant posts are something else.
     
  9. Jay Jay Okocha

    Donor

    What is your opinion on the EU and other nation states/organizations role here?
     
    IHHH likes this.
  10. Eathan Edwards

    Eathan Edwards Well-Known Member

    Have two employees from Iraq that moved here during the war - both had family members killed as a result of the US invasion- there is very minimal US support from Iraqi's (shocker)
     
    AIOLICOCK likes this.
  11. Jay Jay Okocha

    Donor

    Where is the straw man?

    It’s a post that you don’t want to deal with.
     
    leroi likes this.
  12. Joe_Pesci

    Joe_Pesci How can less be more? It's impossible
    Donor

    In what respect?
     
  13. Jay Jay Okocha

    Donor

    Their role. That’s what respect I’m asking.

    Because there’s plenty of people in here screaming about Iraq and US coups - how did the EU member states act towards that?
     
  14. Joe_Pesci

    Joe_Pesci How can less be more? It's impossible
    Donor

    It seems like you think you have some kind of checkmate set up where people who want to move away from fossil fuels can't also think Norway has good public policy
     
    CaneKnight and TwoPoor like this.
  15. Joe_Pesci

    Joe_Pesci How can less be more? It's impossible
    Donor

    No one is screaming. But um, they followed the U.S.'s wild goose chase into Iraq despite huge protests in their own countries? I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at
     
  16. Mister Me Too

    Mister Me Too Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    Florida State SeminolesNew York MetsNew York KnicksNew York Jets

    Some of the same people that mismanaged Iraq are now running this operation as well, being against making the same mistakes of the past is not the same as being pro-Maduro.

    Just like Iraq all discussions centers around regime change, there’s no discussion on what happens after there’s a regime change, no outline of what this administration considers a successful mission.

    But by all means continue to believe that this time US intervention will succeed, don’t let history get in the way of your ignorance.
     
    #216 Mister Me Too, Feb 24, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2019
    CaneKnight, FelipeG and BellottiBold like this.
  17. AIOLICOCK

    AIOLICOCK Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    South Carolina GamecocksAtlanta BravesCarolina PanthersHouston TexansBuffalo Sabres

    Used to work with a dude from Iraq; same thing.
     
  18. fsudan

    fsudan Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Florida State SeminolesJacksonville JaguarsTiger Woods

    :laugh:

    You really are the new dbl. let's fight
     
  19. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor
    Clemson Tigers

    literally the entire post is you creating premises that no one argued, from pretending people argued Venezuela has no role in its own economic climate, to convoluted arguments that for some reason pro environmental people are hypocrites if they think the us shouldn't intervene to some nonsense that anti intervention people should never agree with russia or china on issues because they're predominantly left leaning?

    its literal word vomit
     
  20. AIOLICOCK

    AIOLICOCK Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    South Carolina GamecocksAtlanta BravesCarolina PanthersHouston TexansBuffalo Sabres

    The US military has a pretty shitty track record, fam.
     
    CaneKnight likes this.
  21. Eathan Edwards

    Eathan Edwards Well-Known Member

    This is a good summation - basically we don't have a clear objective in either country
     
  22. AIOLICOCK

    AIOLICOCK Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    South Carolina GamecocksAtlanta BravesCarolina PanthersHouston TexansBuffalo Sabres

    Didn't dbl clown on you in legendary fashion? :yaoface:
     
  23. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor
    Clemson Tigers

    like others have said, for the 90th time, being against US intervention with literal financial interests as the reason stated on more than one occasion, led by people intimately involved with the Iraq invasion and Iran-Contra

    does not mean you're pro-Maduro
     
  24. fsudan

    fsudan Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Florida State SeminolesJacksonville JaguarsTiger Woods

    oh yes legendary fashion. Aren't you handicapped
     
  25. IHHH

    IHHH Well-Known Member
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishMontreal Canadiens

    What is your suggestion? Just let them all die?
     
    NothingIsOT likes this.
  26. Joe_Pesci

    Joe_Pesci How can less be more? It's impossible
    Donor

    :idk: I heard on the Intercepted podcast that the U.S. blockade on Venezuela is worth something like $20 billion. Maybe lift that?
     
    TAXTAXTAX likes this.
  27. leroi

    leroi Rival Shark Boat Captain
    Donor

    after all this discussion, I think everyone can agree on one point, that AOILICOCK is a dumbass
     
    MoJo likes this.
  28. IHHH

    IHHH Well-Known Member
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishMontreal Canadiens

    Ok
     
  29. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor
    Clemson Tigers

    US really needs to rethink using foreign policy force on countries it doesn't like that basically involves pointed measures to hurt the population hoping they'll overthrow the government.

    I get people think targeted sanctions on individuals aren't that strong, but hurting people who you then want to ride in on a tank to save is an odd dichotomy to square especially under the humanitarian relief banner.
     
  30. Joe_Pesci

    Joe_Pesci How can less be more? It's impossible
    Donor

    you looking for someone to swap stories with?
     
  31. Eathan Edwards

    Eathan Edwards Well-Known Member

    Even when you fly into Kurdistan private- they turn off the lights in the cabin to reduce the chance you get shot down by a missile. And the pilot announced this shit.

    Never again.
     
    shaolin5, ramszoolander and MoJo like this.
  32. IHHH

    IHHH Well-Known Member
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishMontreal Canadiens

    It’s a tough point to make on either side. Socialism to some sounds like less individual freedom. For others it sounds like a great solution.

    I never can get past the idea that humans don’t really care about each other. Socialism is doomed, it will never work because of human nature.
     
    shaolin5 likes this.
  33. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor
    Clemson Tigers

    wat
     
    Eamudo229 likes this.
  34. IHHH

    IHHH Well-Known Member
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishMontreal Canadiens

    You want me to capitalize it?
     
  35. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
    Staff Donor
    Clemson Tigers

    I'm not sure how its related to my post.
     
    Eamudo229 and IHHH like this.
  36. fsudan

    fsudan Well-Known Member
    Donor
    Florida State SeminolesJacksonville JaguarsTiger Woods

    just trying to get you laid
     
  37. IHHH

    IHHH Well-Known Member
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishMontreal Canadiens

    Yeah. My bad, I misread that post I quoted.
     
  38. Mister Me Too

    Mister Me Too Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    Florida State SeminolesNew York MetsNew York KnicksNew York Jets

    There’s a wide divide between let them all die and let’s rush in without a plan.
     
    IHHH likes this.
  39. AIOLICOCK

    AIOLICOCK Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    South Carolina GamecocksAtlanta BravesCarolina PanthersHouston TexansBuffalo Sabres

    My vagina isn't handicapped:dealwithit:
     
  40. IHHH

    IHHH Well-Known Member
    Notre Dame Fighting IrishMontreal Canadiens

    Everything is broken in you if you claim to be a chef and can’t make a proper aioli
     
  41. Frank Martin

    Frank Martin tough love makes better posters
    Donor
    South Carolina GamecocksBaltimore OriolesBaltimore RavensLiverpool

    They hated America so much they moved to the US...
     
  42. NothingIsOT

    NothingIsOT I got you COACH!
    Donor

    Mister Me Too

    What is your solution to this problem?
     
  43. Eathan Edwards

    Eathan Edwards Well-Known Member

    I mean you can both be happy to live in the best economy in the world while also not being pumped that we bombed your family.
     
  44. Joe_Pesci

    Joe_Pesci How can less be more? It's impossible
    Donor

    love it or leave it
     
  45. Frank Martin

    Frank Martin tough love makes better posters
    Donor
    South Carolina GamecocksBaltimore OriolesBaltimore RavensLiverpool

    What gets you to the point where you're trying so hard that you cape for Sadaam Hussein?
     
  46. Frank Martin

    Frank Martin tough love makes better posters
    Donor
    South Carolina GamecocksBaltimore OriolesBaltimore RavensLiverpool

    I'm just laughing that two guys who live in a democracy would argue that Iraq was better off under Sadaam.

    You can be upset family members died, but realize you're not being rational.
     
  47. Joe_Pesci

    Joe_Pesci How can less be more? It's impossible
    Donor

    you really want someone to engage you on this :laugh:
     
    TC likes this.
  48. Eathan Edwards

    Eathan Edwards Well-Known Member

    They lived there, but I'm sure we have a better perspective.

    Also, I have no dog in this fight - I have two employees that I see on a regular basis that very clearly have a negative opinion of the US impact overall in Iraq. That doesn't mean Saddam wasn't a fucking war criminal - I'm only relaying what people that actually went through it say currently.
     
    FelipeG likes this.
  49. Mister Me Too

    Mister Me Too Well-Known Member
    Donor TMB OG
    Florida State SeminolesNew York MetsNew York KnicksNew York Jets

    I’m not a military leader or a high ranking diplomat, but in my opinion the US needs to have a plan in place that extends beyond change of power. Also bringing in the military should not be done until all diplomatic channels are exhausted.
     
  50. Frank Martin

    Frank Martin tough love makes better posters
    Donor
    South Carolina GamecocksBaltimore OriolesBaltimore RavensLiverpool

    How old are they and where are they from in Iraq?