Electric Vehicles

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by racer, Apr 8, 2021.

  1. Name P. Redacted

    Name P. Redacted I have no money and I'm also gay
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    THE SMARTER FINANCIAL DECISION IS TO BUY A $40K CAR AND NOT A $90K ONE
     
  2. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    woah let's not get crazy here, need my class signifier for the boys
     
  3. AptosDuck

    AptosDuck Pedantic Hausfrau
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    I'm still a bit pissed about paying $35k for the wife's Lexus in 2009
     
  4. racer

    racer Fuck Tucker, Tucker sucks.
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    Both sides need to stop viewing it as a reward or assistance, and look at it more as a leveling tool to bring EVs into an affordable range.
    If you’re in the 20k price range can go get a Chevy Cruze for 20k or a Chevy Bolt EV for 32.5k with 12.5k rebate then all of a sudden you can realistically choose that Bolt, especially when you factor in the 1/3 energy cost per year and such. That’s a buttload of customers. The same thing at 90k down to 78k works on the same principle, but the customer base is so much smaller up there and much closer to terminal when it comes to EV adoption. If automakers are focused on the luxury segment they won’t have as many resources to put into the affordable segments to produce adequate volume, market, or develop cost saving/value adds.
     
  5. Thoros of Beer

    Thoros of Beer Academy Award-Winning Actor, Tim Allen
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    Ride a bike
     
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  6. Name P. Redacted

    Name P. Redacted I have no money and I'm also gay
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    Maybe when we have bikable cities. I would ride my bike to work occasionally in Montana and would nearly get ran over about 30% of the time.
     
  7. afb

    afb Spoiler Alert: Pawnee, IN may not be on a map.
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  8. Thoros of Beer

    Thoros of Beer Academy Award-Winning Actor, Tim Allen
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    Watch where ur going
     
  9. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    my brother was a huge biking guy when he lived in montana, moved to northern VA and sold his bike in two weeks because drivers ran him off the road multiple times
     
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  10. racer

    racer Fuck Tucker, Tucker sucks.
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    That range bomb
     
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  11. Gotch Yarbrough

    Gotch Yarbrough Canada eh?
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    It is basically government subsidization of EV producers that allows them to sell relatively higher priced electric vehicles at somewhat competitive prices with the expectation that EVs eventually become the norm and independently viable. Tesla would've probably gone bankrupt without the prior version, and the current proposal helps legacy manufacturers bridge the financial gap from ICE to EV.

    The buyers are just the secondary beneficiary. And the high-priced market won't dominate the EV space moving forward like it has in the past, so from the industry perspective there is less need to push for legislation that favors high priced buyers, especially if that's what it takes to get the bill passed.
     
  12. CF3234

    CF3234 Fan of: Bandwagons
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    I can get behind that argument. Still prices me out of the market but that’s a much better argument than anything else posted itt.
     
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  13. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    Yea racer put it that way earlier. In that sense, I get it. I had never had anyone put it that way. I always viewed it as an incentive to the buyer to choose EV, in which case it wouldn't make sense to have a cap on it. "You make too much so we don't care what you buy" is a terrible argument and many were making itt earlier. What you and racer said makes way more sense.
     
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  14. Killy Me Please

    Killy Me Please I lift things up and put people down.
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    Hmmm. Not sure why they took that approach.
     
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  15. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    I really want that Rivian but man I have a hard time buying a new truck from a first time builder. Feels like a huge gamble. Would feel much better if it was Ford or Tesla making it.
     
  16. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    you're priced out of the arbitrary SINGULAR EV you want, that's it, not EV's in general or even luxury EV's
     
  17. pianoman

    pianoman my drinks are free
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    That’s so huge I have no idea why Ford wouldn’t make that clear but it further validates my reservation. A 400 mile range is huge.
     
  18. CF3234

    CF3234 Fan of: Bandwagons
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    None of the other EVs have the features I’m looking for. So yeah, I’m out of the market.
     
  19. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    that's what we're all saying, you want a government handout to get into a 90k vehicle at a discount despite really being able to pay that price if you wanted and have incredibly narrow requirements
     
  20. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    Can't the same be said for the person that wants the 50k F150 but wouldn't buy it without the incentive?
     
  21. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    can they get into a 50k f150 without the discount?

    that's a much stickier question than in the 90k market
     
  22. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    You act like 12k is just chump change that somebody that can afford an 80k truck wouldn't give a flying fuck about. Like they just lose it in the couch oops.
     
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  23. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    NOT TO BE THAT GUY

    but if you calculate the difference between a monthly payment on a 85k or a 95k payment

    yeah, it doesn't fucking matter if the former is good
     
  24. afb

    afb Spoiler Alert: Pawnee, IN may not be on a map.
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    THAT'S

    NOT

    THE

    POINT

    The point is EVs in general cost about 10ish thousand more than their gas counterparts. A model 3 shouldn't be 48k. So the government is trying to get the person who would typically be in that market for that 35k car and give them the difference so they can get an EV instead of an ICE vehicle. (similarly with the SR model 3 and lots of other EVs that are in the high 30s that would now be in the high 20s).

    The government doesn't care about people who can afford 90k cars, nor should they.
     
  25. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    12k is 12k any way you slice it. I've been looking at the 392 for months. Yes, I can afford it, but it feels very wasteful to buy it. But if the dealer called me tomorrow and said they'd sell it for 68k rather than 80k, I'd walk there to buy it. You can say it's only $200 difference a month, which isn't a big deal for me, but it's still $12k and I'd feel much better about buying it.
     
  26. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    you keep saying the bold but it's literally not, if 12k is 35% of your car vs 8% of your purchase it's a much different scenario. that money is functionally different which you admit by saying it's not a big deal to you.

    you're just explaining your own irrational decision making process
     
  27. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    *taps the robespierre did nothing wrong sign*
     
  28. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    Yes, the 12k may be a bigger deal to the guy buying a 40k car but 12k is still 12k. It may not prohibit me from buying the Rivian but getting it would definitely be a positive and make the Rivian more attractive.
     
  29. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    so 12k, is not just 12k
     
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  30. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    It literally is.
     
  31. AptosDuck

    AptosDuck Pedantic Hausfrau
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    After 4 dozen posts the argument is still just "but I want the rebate too"
     
  32. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    if you can't understand the disparate utility of $ as peoples income changes you aren't worth talking to
     
  33. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    No, it's really not. If the goal is to get manufacturers to make more affordable EV, ok cool. If the goal is to get more people to buy EV, it should apply to every EV.
     
  34. AptosDuck

    AptosDuck Pedantic Hausfrau
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  35. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    If you can't grasp that 12k is still large enough enough be important to someone buying a 90k vehicle, this is pointless. Every person buying a 90k vehicle isn't a billionaire thay scoffs at 12k. If it were $500, whatever. But $12k is a lot of money, even for someone buying a 90k vehicle.
     
  36. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    you can't admit the disparate utility is enormous, even while admitting it doesn't mean anything to you

    its a lost cause
     
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  37. AptosDuck

    AptosDuck Pedantic Hausfrau
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    So it's not enough to be OK with the premise, you have to set up a false premise and then spend the evening arguing against it

    Do you live near a beach? Because I think you could use a walk
     
  38. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    That's never been the argument. Of course it means more going form 50 to 38 than 90 to 78 but 12k is still 12k and it's still important to the guy at 90/78. You act like someone buying a 90k truck just scoffs at 12k and it wouldn't affect what they buy and that's just wrong.
     
  39. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    Multiple itt are arguing that it shouldn't apply bc the person making 90k doesn't need it. I think that's dumb.

    I've said multiple times that racer argument makes sense. That's not what others are arguing though.
     
  40. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    then why deny this for multiple posts

    its bizarre the degree to which you're digging in
     
  41. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    I haven't at all.

    Again, if the goal is to make EV more attractive to buyers, it should apply to all EV. That's not a wild take at all. The 90k EV is more appealing at 78k just like the 50k EV is more appealing at 38k. Is the disparity as severe? No, but it doesn't change that it makes the 90k one more appealing to be at 78k.

    Now, if the goal is to get manufacturers to make more 40k EV, that's a completely different argument and I can get behind that. I've said it multiple times itt. But that's now what you've been arguing.
     
  42. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    Goodnight.
     
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  43. CF3234

    CF3234 Fan of: Bandwagons
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    You appealed to your county property appraiser to lower your property taxes because you didn’t want to pay as much per year for your home and then show up and lecture me for wanting an overpriced vehicle at a more reasonable price. If you can afford your property taxes, why appeal? Because you wanted to pay a few dollars less per month. Simple enough.

    90k to 78k is a roughly $250 a month savings. That’s a 23% price difference per month. That’s not insignificant at all
     
    #493 CF3234, May 28, 2021
    Last edited: May 28, 2021
  44. AHebrewToo

    AHebrewToo Albino Hebrew Extraordinaire
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    After reading through the last couple pages I keep coming back to this: Imagine having to finance a Rivian and not just paying cash.

    Ha!
     
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  45. Redav

    Redav One big ocean
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    You priced yourself out of the market by wanting a car you apparently can't afford.
     
  46. Name P. Redacted

    Name P. Redacted I have no money and I'm also gay
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    It’s dbl he’s got a thick fucking skull.
     
  47. PAHokie

    PAHokie Can't a bitch living say I bought her Michael Kors
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    Oh that’s great. I’m 90% sure I’m converting my reservation to an order in the fall.
     
    racer likes this.
  48. CF3234

    CF3234 Fan of: Bandwagons
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    Yup. Was hopeful that the credit would bring it more into my range, was not the case.
     
  49. Redav

    Redav One big ocean
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    Buy a cheaper car???
     
  50. Thoros of Beer

    Thoros of Beer Academy Award-Winning Actor, Tim Allen
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    Cars have very limited use, but legs can do many things