The Ringer Thread: Complain about everything, yet still consume content

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by Truman, May 8, 2015.

  1. yaywaffles

    yaywaffles suck my flaps you piece of shit
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    While I like some of the solutions mentioned, I feel like the underlying issue here is analytics more generally. This isn't uniquely a basketball problem. as long as the numbers can chart an optimal strategy for success, teams are going to conform to that.
     
  2. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    I think the goal should be to make things mostly even. So if you have a + post up player it's optimal. Now the drive and kick 3 pt style is so overwhelmingly valuable that even with below average 3pt shooters it's still the most efficient.
     
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  3. Dudley Dawson2

    Dudley Dawson2 Well-Known Member
    Penn State Nittany Lions

    The franchise tag in the NFL keeps the mass player movement at a bare minimum. Imagine if Cleveland could franchise tag Lebron?

    I watch a ton of nba games and have been a league pass guy for years. Games have become extremely predictable to me which is something that didn't happen 5 years ago. I also think officiating is awful and needs to be re-evaluated.

    Re ringer: I have been an in house counsel for a large media company for years. Every media company knows that you protect your profit centers at all costs. People shit on Simmons but he's really a pretty smart guy when it comes to content and he actually lets his employees spread their wings a bit and see if they can be awesome at different stuff. I'd be shocked if he doesn't spin off the podcasts. Any writing talent already appears or should be appearing on podcasts already. If they aren't, they should be looking for an exit. It's not like the Ringer has any writing talent where I'm waiting for their next piece. Sure, they do put out some decent content from time to time but it's minimal.

    I think Bill missed an opportunity to really take over the national college basketball and college football spaces with some legit podcasts and talent. They are just throwaway areas for him.
     
    #5553 Dudley Dawson2, Jan 23, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2020
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  4. War Grundle

    War Grundle Nole Mercy
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    It's because the main 4-6 people at the Ringer didnt go to big football or basketball schools in college so they dont have the natutal affinity for those sports.

    Simmons
    Fennessy
    Litman
    Dobbins
    Ryan
    Concepcion
    Serrano
     
  5. ShuPoor

    ShuPoor My life for comrade Britney
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    OSP was an actual thing until the talent left the company
     
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  6. MtOread

    MtOread chopped and scrooged
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    I think the early 4 that went to the Ringer were Chris Ryan, Mallory Rubin, Sean Fennessey, and Juliet Litman. I could see the 4 of them being the only ones that have any equity.
     
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  7. chuckmasterflex

    chuckmasterflex There are four lights
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    Mentioned it before but the Ringer FC podcast is inexplicable to me. They'd put it out ever two weeks, and had it hosted by a guy who didn't watch any games outside Arsenal and who would throw out bad takes I guess he saw on twitter.

    Why even have a podcast when no one involved is even interested in talking about the topic? You can't find 3 people in the office who watch the premier league?
     
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  8. Gallant Knight

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    Have you not heard of the ringer Union? They’ll be fine
     
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  9. Gallant Knight

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    That is a safe bet
     
  10. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    bryan curtis and brian phillips are auto-read for me
     
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  11. Dudley Dawson2

    Dudley Dawson2 Well-Known Member
    Penn State Nittany Lions

    From my experience in dealing with new media companies, Bill has undoubtedly spread some equity out to his top team but he and HBO probably controlled nearly 100% (maybe some other private investors we don't know about) when they started the company. After all, they brought all the money to the table.

    No offense to the 4 but I seriously doubt their talent warranted any type of equity in the Ringer upon formation. Bill was the talent.
     
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  12. ShuPoor

    ShuPoor My life for comrade Britney
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    Emphasis on the past tense "was"
     
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  13. Gallant Knight

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    Someone about to pay $150-200m for him so think you’re wrong there
     
  14. ShuPoor

    ShuPoor My life for comrade Britney
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    No I'm right that he sucks now. Some spotify backing VC bro throwing 9 figures at him in between lines of cocaine doesn't change that.
     
  15. Gallant Knight

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    wish i could suck as bad as he does and pocket $100 million
     
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  16. War Grundle

    War Grundle Nole Mercy
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    I still wish he wrote more. Loved reading him back in 2002-3 in college. His mailbags were so good.
     
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  17. Gallant Knight

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    think he figured out the money was in podcasting and decided to dedicate his resources there. looks like the right move
     
  18. zeberdee

    zeberdee wheel snipe celly boys
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    I'd say you're halfway there but that may be a disservice to Simmons.
     
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  19. ShuPoor

    ShuPoor My life for comrade Britney
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    I'm sure you do, you just haven't figured out how to monetize it.
     
  20. Gallant Knight

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    eh i monetize it pretty well just not to the tune of 100m
     
  21. ZeroPointZero

    ZeroPointZero Cafe Altura CEO Dylan Miskowitz
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    Book of Basketball 2.0 =

    [​IMG]
     
  22. Dudley Dawson2

    Dudley Dawson2 Well-Known Member
    Penn State Nittany Lions

    Agree. If Bill wanted to do a book of basketball 2.0, he should've written a book. I get why he couldn't take the time to write a worthy successor to BoB but he could've signed up a few of his peeps he trusts and they could've done it together. This BoB podcast is quite hit or miss. Enjoyed some episodes but some of them are pretty dumb, the one with Shea Serrano on Reggie Miller and the recent one talking about the Knicks were very poor imo. I guess I like the ones with real basketball dudes like Morrey, Stein and Nash than typical homer fan writers. One with JA might have been my favorite.

    There has to be some sort of model where you can get true professionals to talk about shit. I think Bill is on the right track with some episodes such as QT talking rewatchables and some of the BoB pods with legit, knowledgeable dudes like JA. This type of stuff I'd pay money for. I wouldn't pay for Sean and Concepcion to talk about the Knicks or Shea Serrano to talk Fast Five and the NBA starting 5 comparables. Shit is horrendous.
     
  23. MG2

    MG2 No judgement in brainstorming
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    I've enjoyed the ones I've listened to, and I've skipped the ones I haven't been interested in :idk:
     
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  24. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    yeah i can parse which ones I think will be good pretty easily by guest/topic
     
  25. Fran Tarkenton

    Fran Tarkenton Well-Known Member
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    doing it in podcast form was him mailing it in

    he's latched too hard onto podcasts at the expense of his written content and the website. Bill finds a niche and then milks it dry, which he did more broadly with NBA NBA NBA everything.
     
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  26. Handcuffed

    Handcuffed TMB OG
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    him doing it in podcast form makes a lot of sense when you consider he's trying to sell his company :twocents:
     
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  27. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    there's a difference between quality product and most profitable product
     
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  28. Handcuffed

    Handcuffed TMB OG
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    I'm pretty sure people are liking his basketball podcasts so maybe you're just whining? he hasn't written anything - not a book, not a column - in years and has talked multiple times about how he doesn't have the ability to write anymore. so perhaps the product he's distributing now is the highest quality product he can produce?

    aka

    bill lost his fastball
     
  29. MG2

    MG2 No judgement in brainstorming
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    This makes no sense to me. I'd rather he talk about the Nash-era Suns with Steve Nash on a podcast than write about the Nash era Suns in his own words. I'd rather he talk about the Shaq/Kobe Lakers with Adande on a podcast than write in his own words (again).

    This seems like stuff people are only saying because they hate Simmons and want to criticize everything he does. Anyone else does this and it gets nothing but positive response.
     
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  30. ZeroPointZero

    ZeroPointZero Cafe Altura CEO Dylan Miskowitz
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    I'm just confused by a project that was supposed to be about all the stories/players/etc that emerged after the book was released, and instead we are rehashing Reggie Miller's career with Shea Serrano? I think people expected more after those first few episodes (which were good)

    I can guarantee you that if Zach Lowe decided to do a 1999 Knicks throwback pod and chose the 50 year old millennial muppet Jason Concepcion of all people, he would get nothing close to a positive response.
     
  31. poor paul

    poor paul Well-Known Member
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    I can’t think of a single person I’d rather listen to talk about if Reggie Miller is a superstar less than Shea Serrano, and I absolutely love Shea’s books/articles/twitter.

    On the flip side, I’m with MG2 that stuff like the Nash interview is premium content.
     
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  32. MG2

    MG2 No judgement in brainstorming
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    If Lowe did a bad podcast, people might call it a bad podcast. They wouldn't call him lazy for not doing it in book or article form, or call him out for the series in general.

    I think you're getting caught up in the name on the first part, which is irrelevant. The Book of Basketball 2.0 doesn't mean it has to only be stories about stuff since the book came out, nor should we really want that. Some of the better pods have been about stuff he already covered in the book because now it's a podcast and he's getting other views on it along with his. The title is no different from 30 for 30. ESPN is still doing 30 for 30 docs long after the 30 year anniversary and they're well over 30 docs. It's just a umbrella you can put a lot of thing under to differentiate it from his normal podcast.
     
  33. chuckmasterflex

    chuckmasterflex There are four lights
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  34. CTownND

    CTownND Well-Known Member

    I'm open to comments / changes of opinion on this, but I don't think what Simmons is doing is that bad or abnormal. Dozens of companies are sold every week with "labor" having little to no insight into what's going on in the sale. If anything, in a people heavy business, news of a sale would disrupt the company, hurting the buyer, seller, and ultimately labor of both businesses.

    If a unionized pipe fitting business sold themselves to a larger pipe fitting business, nobody tells the pipe fitters about the transaction until it's completed. I'm not saying that's great - but at what point does an owner have to notify all of his employees of a transaction? When there's first interest? When a deal is getting negotiated? What happens if a deal falls through - you just made everyone worry and crazy for a month. If my boss told me live time updates every time he got an offer to sell his business, or was talking to someone about it, etc. - I'd go crazy.
     
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  35. Josey Wales

    Josey Wales Well-Known Member
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    I can’t imagine paying for a Bill Simmons podcast, and I hope that doesn’t come off like a hot take.
     
  36. ShuPoor

    ShuPoor My life for comrade Britney
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    It's cool to the touch
     
  37. Paddy Murphy

    Paddy Murphy Well-Known Member
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    I almost flamed this thread with some of the pathetic Ringer Union and Union boot lickers (to use a board favorite term) tweets when they started crying about not being involved in sale discussions (which lol, of course they fucking aren’t).

    They got their fun Union and get to make believe they are oppressed labor at a company where in fact they have more freedom than 99% of all media employees and a boss who is 99% more open to exploration than all bosses. They decided to stick it in their bosses eye, now he’s selling, la la land is coming to an end, and 90% of them are going to be unemployed and back to writing and producing click bait on a per assignment wage. Fucking classic. Maybe should have just shown up to work and tried to make the most of a really unique and desirable opportunity.
     
  38. chuckmasterflex

    chuckmasterflex There are four lights
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    What exactly would be the point of buying the ringer and firing everyone working there
     
  39. ShuPoor

    ShuPoor My life for comrade Britney
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    Hey nephew Kyle
     
  40. Gallant Knight

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    They would be buying the profitable part of the business. Not the blog
     
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  41. Paddy Murphy

    Paddy Murphy Well-Known Member
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    don’t know who that is but I assume you got me good.
     
  42. zeberdee

    zeberdee wheel snipe celly boys
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    it’s totally normal to take pleasure in watching normal people lose their jobs while celebrating their corporate masters making millions.
     
  43. Gallant Knight

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    Was totally predictable when they unionized

    that’s why people don’t feel sorry for them
     
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  44. MG2

    MG2 No judgement in brainstorming
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    I don't know what I'm supposed to do with this story and don't want to pick sides because I don't really like either at the moment. Simmons is an asshole who probably should tell his employees if he's seriously considering selling the company, and the Ringer Union thing has felt very "look at us!" from the start and I'm not entirely sure what these tweets are meant to accomplish.
     
  45. MODEVIL

    MODEVIL Well-Known Member
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    I've been on both sides in M&A and there are NDA's and the owners didn't say anything until the deal was done. Many of us knew it was coming but it was not something we talked about. I've worked in my current role on the acquisition due diligence team and owners have absolutely fucked themselves by saying too much and getting too many employees involved.

    They can all paint Simmons as an asshole but he received investment to start the Ringer and it would make sense that his partners would want to cash out. It's also prudent to not say anything right now. None of these people would have their current jobs without him.
     
  46. BudKilmer

    BudKilmer Well-Known Member
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    feel exactly the same way. I’m not sure what Bill can say if anything right now. Maybe he can put up a rumormongerer page for Ringer acquisitions
     
  47. MG2

    MG2 No judgement in brainstorming
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    Do we even know there are negotiations? All I've seen is Spotify is/was interested, and Simmons asked for at least $100M more than what people consider the site to the worth.
     
  48. War Grundle

    War Grundle Nole Mercy
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    I don’t like to see anyone lose their job but in this instance they are delusional if they think they should be given the lowdown on M & A discussions.
     
  49. Gallant Knight

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    They’ve been delusional from the start. The Gawker union didn’t save deadapin and the ringer union is effectively costing most of its members their jobs
     
  50. ShuPoor

    ShuPoor My life for comrade Britney
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    Pretty wild that Simmons had no interest in making nine figures until his labor force unionized
     
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