The Twelve - Justin Cronin (The Passage #2)

Discussion in 'TMB Book Club' started by The Blackfish, Nov 11, 2012.

  1. Iron Mickey

    Iron Mickey is this thing on?
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    Is Alicia going to be Zero's lieutenant for the final fight?
    Seems appropriate given her relationship with Peter. He'll have to choose between her and Amy.
     
  2. The Blackfish

    The Blackfish The Fish in Black
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    I posted that I really hope not

    I get that she is changing but that would be sooo unlike her character and a betrayal of the colonel and Peter. Amy changed too and stayed good. Given the choice though Peter would choose Amy I'm fairly certain
     
  3. Iron Mickey

    Iron Mickey is this thing on?
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    I think so, too, but it seems to be the way he teed it up.

    Especially with peter's comments about how she had retreated so far into herself that she wasn't the same person anymore. I dunno, just a bad feeling.
     
  4. rv12

    rv12 Cowabunga
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    What the hell is up with Grey? Granted, I just read his first chapter but it really confused me.
     
  5. The Blackfish

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    Where to begin? Well he likes corn-holing little boys for starters, then there's the whole encounter with The Zero in the first book
     
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  6. rv12

    rv12 Cowabunga
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    I understand that. Is his first exposure in this book directly after the events in Colorado? I'm just confused to his timeline I guess. I thought he'd be turned by now.
     
  7. The Blackfish

    The Blackfish The Fish in Black
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    Yes there are multiple flashbacks in this book
     
  8. LKRFN88jp

    LKRFN88jp Aces!
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    Just finished this
    Much like you, I was taken aback that Cronin would just leave everything we've known behind and start with entire new characters, but I was pretty hooked from the start tbh. He just does such a good job making you care about the characters, even if you don't know them yet. Incredibly ballsy of him to devote ~30% of his sequel to (a) people we hadn't met and (b) a time period in which the first book started in.

    That said, I really liked the decision. Was great seeing more of the outbreak from different eyes, because The Passage (once the initial shit went down) was really Wolgast and Amy doing their thing/trying to survive. So I enjoyed that.

    Pumped to see where things go next, definitely hoping to return to the characters that dominated the second half of The Passage though.
     
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  9. The Blackfish

    The Blackfish The Fish in Black
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    not quite yet! But just go with it Cronin does a good job with it and it all ties together
     
  10. RonBurgundy

    RonBurgundy Well-Known Member

    Grey = Zero's familiar. Alicia = Amy's familiar. Since Zero is the baddest drac it makes sense Grey is the strongest familiar, the colony using his blood to have eternal life. Amy had yet to turn full viral because she hadn't drank blood and was getting weaker and sicker, then clearly she goes to Houston and drank Carter's blood, turning her into a full drac, and maturing her to mid 20 year old Amy, since going full Drac does that to all people regardless of age. Alicia wasn't full drac yet, merely Amy's familiar, but her transforming to full drac seems inevitable. The ending of the third novel will be Peter and human crew killing Amy(dead?)/Alicia, after they kill Zero. Thereby wiping out the curse, cut to prologue and a new exploration of idiots in Belize trying to find the source of the virus starting it again.

    Also liked this book better IMO. More action, especially at the end.

    On mobile after a 36 hour shift forgive typos/grammar
     
  11. The Blackfish

    The Blackfish The Fish in Black
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    the ex army guy who was friends with Peter and was in jail before Amy broke him out, can't recall his name at the moment. Is Amy's familiar
     
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  12. One Knight

    One Knight Waiting for the other shoe to drop
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    Just started this, beginning is full of surprises for sure.

    shocked me that Amy is talking and is like a normal person now, maybe she was at the end of The Passage but it still surprised me. :feelsbadman: about Maus and Theo, looking forward to finding out what happened to them and the rest of the survivors, especially after the "massacre at roswell" teaser at the end of the first
     
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  13. LKRFN88jp

    LKRFN88jp Aces!
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    To here
    Luckily you had let me know not to really expect the regular characters just yet, but still kind of shocked that we're now almost 40% through the book and the main characters have been in it ~5% of the time. Agree on the writing though, was invested in the characters by the end of the part/chapter. Great writing as usual.

    Can't decide on who the woman was. My initial thought was Lacey, but Lila could make sense as well.

    Overall, I liked this part, but unlike part II there wasn't a particular thing that showed why this was here/what part it will play in the story. Though it obviously will/I know nothing.
     
  14. LKRFN88jp

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    To here
    Liked the stuff in the cave. Confused as to what exactly is going on with the guy they met down there. So many different types of virals, seems as though he's a "familiar" so that's interesting.

    The Amy stuff is weird. I don't think it's as simple as he finally getting her period, but she's obviously aging, just at an incredibly slow rate. That said, I feel like something else is going on with her.

    Happy to be back to the characters we know and love, bout to read some more.
     
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  15. LKRFN88jp

    LKRFN88jp Aces!
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    Part V
    Ok wtf is going on. So many things are going on and I really feel like the story made a big leap forward in this section. The biggest thing to me was that things don't seem right with Amy. Zero was definitely talking about her at the end, and honestly it doesn't surprise me because she's seemed a little "off" throughout this book. Maybe it's because five years have passed/she's talking more, but it's definitely not the Amy we've known. And Peter could see something was up too. It's like Zero set this plan in motion forever ago, and was waiting to do something. I wonder if that's why she got sick or whatever? I feel like that was something. And Greer is her familiar? Wtf.

    And then Peter, Michael, and crew (a) see some random person in the road (definitely the same lady from Vorhees and what happened with him (also noticed that Ceps saw the shiny box, so I'm thinking that's what Vorhees and his crew saw way back in the day)) and then (b) one of the shiny boxes opens up, letting virals out? What. The. Fuck. So confused as to why this stuff is happening.

    Just about to dive into part VI, but the last chapter is really sticking with me for a few reasons. First, Martinez just killed his followers. Why would he do that? And second, he knows that Babcock is dead. That to me is huge going forward.

    :popcorn:
     
  16. One Knight

    One Knight Waiting for the other shoe to drop
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    Halfway through part 2, very interesting how he is doing this one. I like getting the background on what it was like in then early days of the breakout, will be interesting to see how they resolve all the characters and still incorporate the current cast.
     
  17. LKRFN88jp

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    Part VI
    So Sara is alive, OH SNAP. Didn't really expect that after the first book ended, but it pleases me because I really enjoyed he character. Took a while for this section to get going, but once again, by the end of it I was hooked.

    Lila being crazy as hell is probably my favorite part about this section though. Even 100 years later she can't get over what happened and is trying to look past it. The stuff with Horace was really interesting. I imagine that type of stuff has happened countless times and he's sick of her.

    Have ~40% left, going to knock out a bit more tonight.
     
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  18. rv12

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    Part VII

    well I don't know what to think of Amy and carter. I'm excited though.

    I think this was my favorite part thus far. The Iowa stuff was great and now I'm really excited to see what Sara and Alicia do when they inevitably run into each other. Also excited for Hollis to run into Sara at some point...I'm expecting a Sun and Jin reunion for you Lost fans.
     
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  19. One Knight

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    Just finished Part II, holy shit a lot happened in there.

    I liked the Grey storyline, don't like Lila as a character but I'm excited to see what happens when she takes Grey's blood, and what happened when Guilder took the rock to Grey. Wondering how they will work Wolgast back into it, if him and Lila will eventually meet back up as virals.

    I was sad and happy for Bernard dying but finding his salvation with Tim at the end, and the twist with April, very cool. Overall I was totally shocked that the book so far has been flashback, but I really like knowing how things went down after the outbreak. Danny was the man, definitely autistic but I like how Cronin wrote it with his character becoming heroic. I'm wondering where they finally ended up, and how April eventually got to The Colony in California.

    So far I really like the book, thinking in terms of the eventual movies, I'm not sure they can structure it the same way as the book, with all the prologue being in the second book. Maybe it would work, but that is very backwards from how Hollywood usually works, having second movies be prequels has been done (Godfather 2) but it seems rare
     
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  20. LKRFN88jp

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    Part VII
    Love that Sara will be working with Lila. That shit is going to get really good. Damn, Lila is crazy. And Sara's kid is there too? :popcorn: Like rv12, this was probably my favorite part of this book. Lots of pieces getting moved around.

    Amy's stuff continues to leave me not knowing wtf is going on. Puts Greer to sleep when he notices blood between her legs. Is she finally getting her period? And then meets up with Carter and he's just locked in this ship? What. The. Fuck.

    Also, the stuff with the fighting reminded me of a better version of this The Walking Dead's same stuff. Wish I would have read this first so I wouldn't have thought back to The Walking Dead, but oh well. Peter just staring the viral down was so badass. Tifty's reaction was gold.

    Pretty sure I said this as I was reading The Passage, but I love that these virals aren't (a) a bunch of idiots and (b) still have their human selves deep inside of them. They plan stuff, they don't just act like dumbasses. But their "souls" I guess you could say, still being in them? Them still reacting? Their final moments being shown to people who know how to look at them/have powers (thinking of an Alicia, Amy, etc)? That's just damn good writing and storytelling. Big fan.
     
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  21. rv12

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    Just got to (part XI spoiler)
    guilder hoisting Amy up with the chains.

    And I'm pissed because I have a 3 hour class now and had to stop reading!!
     
  22. LKRFN88jp

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    Parts VIII and IX
    Great stuff. Did not see the Vale suicide bombing coming, and I feel dumb for it, even though it was obvious something was going on. Worried for Sara though, feel like they're about to (a) figure out her cover or (b) she'll get killed because her kid likes her more than Lila, who btw, is still batshit crazy. Jesus h.

    Happy Alicia got out and was able to kick ass in the process. You could definitely see the emotion she had when she ran into Amy again. Just felt like she wanted to cry for hours to get all the shit that happened out of her. Speaking of Amy, I couldn't tell if Alicia was just viewing her as older (since she has aged a bit since they last saw) or if she's aged to a woman's size/look, because that's kind of how I felt like she was describing her. Either way, wtf. Amy has been so damn different and I can't wait to see what's going on.

    Michael putting together what happened with the virals in Iowa is awesome and reminded me why I liked his character so much in The Passage. So smart.

    The Twelve (or Eleven) are now in Iowa too? :warn:

    Obviously these two (or three, if you count the aforementioned Twelve) groups are on a collision course with the Iowa crew already in place and Peter, Michael, and co on their way. Do wonder what part Alicia and Amy will play going forward. Can't imagine Alicia will want to go back, but maybe her and Amy will do their own thing and go somewhere else entirely.

    Either way, excited to see what happens next. Will probably finish the book tomorrow night, have about 18% left.
     
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  23. rv12

    rv12 Cowabunga
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    Finished it last night. Will post my thoughts on it later. I liked it a lot though.
     
  24. LKRFN88jp

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    Finished
    Liked The Passage more than The Twelve, but still enjoyed The Twelve quite a bit. Read RonBurgundy 's criticisms in The Passage's thread, and I see where he was coming from on certain points. The POV switching at the end was something I was thinking of as it happened. "Ok, Alicia is with who right now, and what's happening? Ok, got it, oh shit they are switching POV's again..." Was just kind of confusing, and I think it would/will be on the big screen, and that's when you're actually watching it on a screen.

    Same with the stuff with Amy/Wolgast. Maybe I need to re-read some of that stuff, but was just confused with how things were happening. It almost felt like the sideways timeline in LOST, where she led him to this place where he could finally be happy after death. But why does this place exist? Really weird.

    Lila sucked, but it was really nice to see her finally snap out of her funk and figure out wtf was going on. Was happy that she didn't kill Kate and ended up killing herself and Grey.

    Alicia is definitely off. Got fucked with in horrible ways and is turning into a viral? Her arch is going to be interesting in the final book.

    The final battle was fucking fantastic, outside of the POV stuff changing so much.

    Reading the final 25% of the book, I couldn't believe that we were leading up to a point of the rest of the Twelve being taken out. Obviously sets up for one final battle with Zero in the final book, but damn, thought we'd have at least one or two more Twelve members to take out in advance.

    That said, I do wonder what exactly we'll get in the final book of the trilogy. A fight with Zero is obviously the endgame. But how do we get there/what will make the book interesting enough to be as long as either of the first two? We dealt with the virals, we dealt with fighting between people themselves, so what's next? Outside of Zero of course. I'm definitely more worried about it being interesting for all those pages, whereas I never felt that way about the first two. Should be interesting.

    Once again though, still liked this book quite a bit, but it lacked something from The Passage that knocks it down a tad.
     
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  25. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
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    Damn. Just reading your guys posts - ive already forgotten so much. Definitely going to have to re-read this before the third installment.

    Maybe I read it wrong or something, but I completely missed where she may be teaming up with Zero. I took it as she is understanding her transition, and her intention is to hunt down Zero and take him out.
     
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  26. rv12

    rv12 Cowabunga
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    I took it the same way.
     
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  27. LKRFN88jp

    LKRFN88jp Aces!
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    Same.
     
  28. RonBurgundy

    RonBurgundy Well-Known Member

    Is Amy's drac strain unique or from Zero? The latter would make for an interesting subplot in book 3, and the former would also potentially create a nice story arc re:Alicia, assuming Amy
    flipped full drac and needs to be destroyed in book 3
    . Pretty sure I already posted my prediction in the Passage thread, but I think I can predict the ending of he triology. Also, I would bet that book 3 discusses more history of the world events ( aka outside of North America) and gives more details about the spread in other countries, and where survivors have quarantined themselves (Indonesia, etc).
     
  29. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
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    Zero was infected in the field when they were in Bolivia or where ever they were in South America. Each of the other 12 had a slightly altered strain.

    At least that is how I recalled it.
     
  30. RonBurgundy

    RonBurgundy Well-Known Member

    Yeah, I just didn't know if Amy's strand "came" from Zero, like if they killed Zero would Amy and Alicia evaporate like end of the Passage.
     
  31. Truman

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    Oh gotcha. That makes for an interesting conundrum.
     
  32. RonBurgundy

    RonBurgundy Well-Known Member

    Nevermind basically said the same thing twice
     
  33. LKRFN88jp

    LKRFN88jp Aces!
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    Yeah I really wanna know what's going on outside the US.
     
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  34. One Knight

    One Knight Waiting for the other shoe to drop
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    Just finished, really liked it, Cronin is absolutely incredible at developing characters and making you care about them. I really liked the different twists and turns, I very much enjoyed the ending, can't wait to see how things progress in the next book, Alicia has become a very interesting character and I just can't figure out how Amy
    goes from being killed in the stadium to being a major part of the next book. When she came to Peter, was it a dream or was she really there? I'm assuming she isn't dead like the rest of the Twelve and she was really there, but I want to see how he explains it. Looking forward to the development of the arc between Alicia and Zero.
     
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  35. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
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    amy didnt die with the rest of the twelve
     
  36. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
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    @jccronin: To those of you inquiring about pub date for #CityofMirrors: nothing's been set yet. Ignore what you see on Amazon; they make that stuff up.


    This leads me to believe it's done, hopefully it gets released soon
     
  37. rv12

    rv12 Cowabunga
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    Can't wait!
     
  38. LKRFN88jp

    LKRFN88jp Aces!
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    Was hoping the bump would have the release date. That said I think he's done too. Release the damn thing! My guess is the fall.
     
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  39. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
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    Last week I got a alert on goodreads that Cronin was taking questions. I asked about the released date, and figured he would ignore it.

    [​IMG]
     
  40. LKRFN88jp

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    Awesome news. Now I know when to do a re-read.
     
  41. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
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    The "right now" scares me. Leads me to think it could get pushed back
     
  42. LKRFN88jp

    LKRFN88jp Aces!
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  43. Truman

    Truman Well-Known Member
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    It's been too long. I miss Amy. Even if she is morphed into scary ass vampire.
     
  44. The Blackfish

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    Shit I'm going to have to reread or at least read some chapter by chapter summary refresher.
     
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  45. Hoss Bonaventure

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    Welp. Looks like I'm going to finishing listening to The Twelve now. Loved Passage but I didn't get into the Twelve as much
     
  46. rv12

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    I'm definitely going to do a reread.
     
  47. laxjoe

    laxjoe Well-Known Member
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    finished today (after starting 1.5 days ago). really enjoyed it. thanks LKRFN88jp for the recommendation and whoever who originally suggested this series for tmb book club 4 years ago.
     
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  48. jkun

    jkun UGA, United, Falcons, Braves, Tennis, Chelsea
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    just finished the passage, not reading the thread to spoil but is this one worth reading?
     
  49. Hoss Bonaventure

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    I'm still only halfway through it because I keep getting sidetracked with podcasts at work, but I do enjoy it and I want to finish the trilogy.
     
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  50. Truman

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    It's good, just not as good as The Passage. If you liked The Passage, it's definitely worth reading - especially with the third book coming out in may
     
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