Tom Herman fired (for real this time), Sark gets hired

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by JGator1, Jan 2, 2021.

  1. dtx

    dtx ruthkanda forever
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    where my clemson and auburn fans at

    how do you guys react to a tone deaf coach?

    need to learn from you
     
  2. zachary

    zachary <3
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    agree with the last statement. there are no facts one way or another on if the song was created with racial intent or not. it is easy to assume it was because of the time it was created but that is just an assumption.
     
  3. TTgator91

    TTgator91 Well-Known Member
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    My boy from the 2007 class or whatever, didn't know he was coaching that's awesome. We called him Blanket
     
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  4. Mr. Bean

    Mr. Bean Well-Known Member

    Do you believe that when the song is sung at football games there is racial intent by those singing it (or the institution)?
     
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  5. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    so intent is stupid to try to glean in general, because its almost always impossible. it just lets people decide on which side they want to be on an issue without really taking a stance on the substance.

    thats why you address whats written and where it came from, there don't seem to be an qualms here!
     
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  6. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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  7. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    these are all the same arguments people made about confederate inspired mascots, dixie, the south will rise again!, etc

    that they're just benign phrases/icons/symbols that come from history, but luckily people have started to understand these things were all parts of an ideological project so regardless of current intent the underlying ideology is destructive. so why keep it around?
     
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  8. dtx

    dtx ruthkanda forever
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    tbf to sark the admin/boosters probably made that a must when they hired him because they’re stuck on that stupid fucking song for some reason

    the ad said they were going to still sing it when herman was coach too

    he probably said something along the lines of we know it’s a texas tradition but we’ll listen to players feedback on the issue instead
     
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  9. Mr. Bean

    Mr. Bean Well-Known Member

    Curious your thoughts on how UVA handled their uniform controversy. Much easier problem to fix than cancelling the school fight song, whatever that’s worth

    https://www.cavalierdaily.com/artic...ites-controversy-over-use-of-serpentine-walls
     
  10. Corky Bucek

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    I’m glad that Auburn passed on Sark and hired a coach who believes in and tweets the Auburn creed.
     
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  11. dtx

    dtx ruthkanda forever
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    he also wears the dabo shirt
     
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  12. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    yeah they changed the logo soon after that article, which based on that article makes sense

    would also disagree that changing a logo is any harder or easier than replacing a song
     
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  13. Mr. Bean

    Mr. Bean Well-Known Member

    It was easy to change the logo bc that wrinkle was newly added as a feature to their logo by Nike, not a tradition of alumni. Plus you could barely see it

    To me it seemed like a real reach. The walls had been lowered decades earlier to correct for the original function of the height of the wall, which was to hide slaves from the public eye. Didn’t make sense to relitigate that IMO.

    D33B4CD2-F2F8-410E-A0D8-4489D76AF2E8.png B2C38416-BA44-405F-AD59-3FE18501C4F3.jpeg
     
  14. Where Eagles Dare

    Where Eagles Dare The Specialist Show On Earth
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    Texas boosters got them a racist boot licker
     
  15. dtx

    dtx ruthkanda forever
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    DEDA2891-C7F4-455D-8510-1D2209CB86F3.jpeg
     
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  16. Redav

    Redav My favorite meat is hotdog
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    Just don't sing it. I don't get what's so hard about it if people are offended and it has a checkered past.
     
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  17. Where Eagles Dare

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    You have to do that when you coach in Utah.

    Now that he's in Blue Georgia he's woke
     
  18. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    i mean lowering them doesnt change the history of why they were built

    just dont create symbols about iconography that has toxic history, ez
     
  19. devine

    devine hi, I am user devine
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    I just think it’s a weird statement to make without talking to the players about it first. It should be their decision
     
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  20. dtx

    dtx ruthkanda forever
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    the texas admin and boosters really fucking suck and would force them to regardless

    but yeah he shouldn’t have said it out loud
     
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  21. Whammy Business

    Whammy Business Well-Known Member
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    Love it or leave it!
     
  22. zachary

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    unfortunately it isn’t that easy as money matters
     
  23. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    then just say that, our program depends on rich people giving us money and those rich people want us to sing it

    it makes everything more honest and sensical
     
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  24. zachary

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    i agree with you but it’s ridiculous to think sark can go out and say that. he got put in a shit position having to answer that question before even meeting with the team(i assume)
     
  25. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    he could have no commented if he genuinely was figuring it out?

    but it also seems clear this topic was brought up during the hiring process, cause that was an unequivocal position he took for someone who as far as i know has no texas ties?
     
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  26. zachary

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    you win
     
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  27. Line 4 Man

    Line 4 Man I still ski on the weekends.
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    Dont care. Still going to the ship
     
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  28. TC

    TC Recruiting has been good
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    He was offered $5mm a year to say what he just said and he accepted
     
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  29. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    not trying to win

    but as someone who is a fan of a school with its own insane confederacy issues on campus and other problematic issues currently I used to struggle with it so complete get the reflex to defend it even if you know in your heart you're doing it to defend the school you like
     
  30. Cornelius Suttree

    Cornelius Suttree I am a landmine
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    W&M and Holy Cross have had some campus debate over their branding recently. So wild W&M still goes with their name
     
  31. Doc Louis

    Doc Louis Well-Known Member
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    As a kid, I thought the Mississippi rebels mascot was a spoof on Confederate generals and their success, or lack thereof. It was like they were cheering for loveable losers like the Chicago Cubs
     
  32. Doc Louis

    Doc Louis Well-Known Member
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    They're called bolo ties, and he's probably getting a few along with a couple of twelve gallon hats and cowboy boots
     
  33. IanBoyd

    IanBoyd Well-Known Member
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    It's pointless to discuss this topic on this board because nuance isn't really a thing here, its either "the song is racist and he's throwing all his black players under the bus" or "lol who cares get over it its a song"

    The reality of the situation is yes, there are black players that feel uncomfortable with the song after learning about its origin and its an extremely unfortunate position for them, a good deal of players also don't care about it one way or the other and just want to play football but simply want to support their teammates. There's also players that grew up fans of the school since birth and the song has been a part of their entire lives and still want to participate in it.

    And now you have a situation where its a literal no win no matter what the coach or administration does even without considering the boosters/fans. You can't force all the players to sing it, that would give the optics of oppression of black athletes again, you can't force people to not sing it, you'd end up with that picture of Sam Enlinger standing by himself after the OU game with the optics of the rest of his team abandoning him, you also can't just let the players choose if they want to stay for the song or not, that gives the optics of a team in turmoil and would kill recruiting.

    On top of all that, the topic has since become a shit show and fire storm that has been hijacked by people with agendas that have next to no interest for what's actually in the best interest for the school or the players.
     
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  34. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    what do you think personally vs doing the pundit thing
     
  35. IanBoyd

    IanBoyd Well-Known Member
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    I've said it before, I don't care if they play the song or not, it's just a song to me, but I don't pretend to speak for all Texas fans or even a majority.
     
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  36. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    so what do you think they should do, reading the tea leaves of your post you seem to understand why it's problematic but give a lot of leeway to "tradition" in the calculus
     
  37. lunchbox

    lunchbox ...
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    That was always going to be the answer and this controversy will fizzle out.
     
  38. IanBoyd

    IanBoyd Well-Known Member
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    I think how our women's basketball has handled it is probably the best of all the shitty options. Every player still stays after the game for the song to show appreciation for the fans, but personal choice in participation.
     
  39. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    i'd be curious if you polled the athletes themselves how it'd shake out % wise

    cause tradition for traditions sake always seems really hard to argue in support of
     
  40. IanBoyd

    IanBoyd Well-Known Member
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    I don't know if there was an official poll or not but the discussion that took place during the summer I already summarized in my post. Hell most of the athletes knew nothing about the origin of the song. As far as "tradition for the sake of tradition" idk what else to say on that, the lyrics itself contains nothing remotely racist and it's not like white/non black people have been using the song for the last 80 years as a secret "hail hydra" wink among themselves.

    I'm curious what your solution would be, from an outsider's perspective.
     
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  41. Gunners

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    How about telling your shitty boosters to fuck off with their demands.
     
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  42. IanBoyd

    IanBoyd Well-Known Member
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    k i'll hop on discord and do that
     
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  43. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    from what I've seen the reason it stays is boosters, so dumpster it

    the argument against is very straight forward, the affirmative arguments that aren't "well it's been the song forever" seem weak and obviously just trying to support a pre chosen conclusion.
     
  44. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    this is why people get confused or irritated in these discussions fwiw, fans seem to feel an obligation to defend the decision with various long winded convoluted explanations, often acting as a PR arm, when the real answer is "the boosters said so"

    which is a fine answer! but fans don't seem to want to just take one on the chin for 80yo rich dudes so they do all the rest instead
     
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  45. IanBoyd

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    But it isn't just "meddling boosters", there are average fans and athletes themselves that want to keep the song. If the % among athletes say is 45/55 slightly in favor of getting rid of it, you still end up with a largely no win situation.

    I mean what the fuck do you expect TMB Texas fans to do about it? I already said I personally don't give a shit if the song stays or not, they can replace the school song with the Sailor Moon intro music tomorrow and I wouldn't care much. It's not like I can respond to these "tell your boosters to fuck off" with a "yea, I'll immediately go contact these people that make my yearly income in 2 hrs and tell them what's what", I wish all the fucking boosters had my attitude of "don't care its just a song bro" about it but they don't so :idk:
     
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  46. Gunners

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    Acting like Texas football will somehow suffer more over a song is pretty crazy. Why not just let it go since you’re at the bottom, much like the Redskins.
     
  47. Lyrtch

    Lyrtch My second favorite meat is hamburger
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    take a poll among athletes/students/etc, figure it out. also just look at the arguments on the merits, what do you think there? as an outsider its pretty obvious which argument holds up.

    i don't expect them to craft defenses of it that's for sure and I don't think people should get defensive about it. you aren't the school, people criticizing it isn't them criticizing you. i'm not sitting here defending dabo at every turn or the renaming of a building this summer if the school didn't agree to it. if your argument is I don't care but I think they should keep it you're siding with the boosters and the pro song fans, which is fine, but you should be able to make a pro song argument that isn't just punditry based or else you'll get chided for being a shill.
     
  48. IanBoyd

    IanBoyd Well-Known Member
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    I mean I'd love for them to slash the athletic budget into that of Minnesota's and give the difference to me so I can stop giving a shit about CFB :idk:
     
  49. IanBoyd

    IanBoyd Well-Known Member
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    Fair, but again, most of the comments from the outside has been made by people who just googled about the topic for 5 mins and want to pile on, like I said this board doesn't exactly do nuance.
     
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  50. Redav

    Redav My favorite meat is hotdog
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    What's the nuance that's being ignored?
     
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