That’s an absurdist reduction of the complaints with the story. I really enjoyed the Luke/Rey/Kylo arc but thought the remainder of the movie was alternatively underdeveloped (Snoke), simplistic (Poe, Finn, First Order), or non-sensical (the entire premise of the flight of the Raddatz from the First Order). They can fix the Snoke issue in IX, but the first two movies in this trilogy seem like wasted opportunities more than anything else - not as bad as the PT, but not something that lives up to the OT, either.
I hope Snoke doesnt get more than a passing mention in IX. Kylo is the more interesting character and now he's the Supreme Leader. Focus on him not the past
Kylo is by leaps and bounds the most interesting of the new characters. It helps that Driver is an odd looking dude.
Oh Jesus Christ. You're one that wants to nitpick tactical decisions in Star Wars? Good luck with that.
I don't consider the central premise of the plot to be a tactical decision. That's not saying something like why did the dreadnought wait so long to launch fighters or asking how the First Order launched a ground assault from a ship that had been split in half or wondering why the Resistance didn't use the Raddus to support its attack on Starkiller or even trying to begin to figure out how the timelines on each of the story arc align, it's saying a major plot line doesn't work in the environment they have created.
I had a few prpbprob with TLJ but them killing off Snoke isn't one of them. Was never a fan of his character. Felt like a knockoff Emperor .
Yea completely brushing away at an all powerful Dark Side sith/lord who managed to turn Luke's nephew and ultimately led to the death of Han Solo is fine, perfectly acceptable world building/storytelling.
WAAAAAHHHH!!! I didn't get to find out who Snoke is! WAAAAAAAH. I had this theory about him and now I'll never know. WAAAAH.
Star wars neck beards just wanted to watch the original trilogy reskinned. I hated the Finn/Rose shit but loved the unpredictability of TLJ. If you want to watch snoke be an all powerful bad guy and have Kylo be redeemed and turn on him in the end then just go watch Return of the Jedi.
What exactly do you want to know? He's a dark side user that ruled the First Order and corrupted Ben. The more interesting story is why Ben was so susceptible to be turned in the first place. Rian made Snoke a means to an end to progress Ben's storyline which I think was the right call as Ben is the better character. Did you just want a retread of the Emperor and Anakin like JJ did when he setup the Emperor ripoff?
Yeah. The whole point of killing Snoke off is to show that he doesn't fucking matter. I'm sorry you spent two years coming in with Snoke theories, but the fucking guy only was in like 4 scenes over two movies. Boba Fett got more screen time than that, and Boba Fett sucks!
His gold robe was the most interesting part Like he was a bored upper class hugh Hefner type that was like “hey I have these powers let’s have a lil fun”
exactly why they should have went with a whole new cast and setting, not continue the skywalker family saga. Whatever they did there would be no winning with them. Team old republic
There will still be no winning. Rian got the green light for a completely new trilogy, set who knows when or where. But since he "ruined Star Wars" with TLJ, these assholes have already dismissed it as garbage.
That’s the common misconception, the Star Wars fanbase isn’t actually a fan of Star Wars, they are fans of complaining
I love TLJ, but I don't get this. did Palpatine not matter in the OT? Snoke turned Kylo to the dark side and orchestrated the connection between Kylo and Rey that was central to the plot of TLJ. whether we learn anything else about him, who knows, but he did play a pretty large part in the story even though he died after only four scenes.
I think something brand new in a completely disconnected part of the SW universe will be a good litmus test for the fanbase. The problem will be if such a creative venture is initially led by Rian. Regardless of whether you love him or not, it’s inherently divisive when you have the writer and director of TLJ at the head of it. That being said, bring on something brand new that doesn’t carry the baggage of having to be slavishly devoted to canon and doesn’t have to carry on existing characters stories
Good point. It's not that he doesn't matter, who he is, where he came from, how he came to lead the FO, all that background shit, THAT'S what doesn't matter.
Agreed, we didn't know anything about the Emperor in the OT. It wasn't until the PT that we learned all the things we never cared about.
The truth is for all the touts about how "vast" and "expansive" the SW universe is, its really got fuck all to work with in terms of actual lore/material to draw from, especially with how convoluted the "EU" or "Legends" are since they're not canon (until Disney suddenly decides a part of it is, ala Thrawn). People don't want to hear about the Skywalkers anymore? Well too bad there's not really any interesting characters from the universe to draw from outside of inventing brand new ones out of thin air like Rey/Poe/Finn and you if you fuck that up then it gets thrown into the trash pile immediately in the minds of certain fans like Snoke. Comic book characters can be rebooted with different variations of origins or storylines, Star Wars doesn't have that luxury, at some point if you're world building in real time, it's going to fuck up and the franchise gets tanked. Look at "Heroes", it was universally praised in season 1 because it "broke the mold" of following a traditional comic superhero, "Wow someone that isn't Superman is flying and lifting buses, this is great!" Then it ran out of ideas by season 2/3 and the fan base turned on it due to the fuck up in world building and the entire franchise is gone. Star Wars can't be afford to be throwing away characters/plots like Snoke, there's only so many chances you have at getting the world building part right, you say "oh w/e Kylo is more interesting anyway", what happens if they fuck up Kylo's story, what's the backup plan? Circle back to Snoke? Re-invent a completely new character out of thin air?
Yea I don't understand the "we don't give a shit about the Skywalkers anymore, Rey is a nobody and unreasonably OP but that's fine and when she's gone its time for the next nobody Mary Sue to step in" crowd.
It's an entire fucking galaxy yes I would like there to be more than two/three characters that are force sensitive. The force which is supposed to be universal and a part of everyone only manifesting itself in the royal family of Skywalkers like people wanted is dumb and the complete opposite of "world building." Give me poor broom stick force kid. You can write 1000 compelling narratives eithout being chained down to past characters. Youre acting like creating new characters is a bad thing.
Also I'd like someone who is upset with Luke's portrayal to explain to me how Luke should have been protrayed in TLJ given the following premises: His nephew whom he was training turned to the dark side and massacred everyone else he was training He's been in exile, purposefully didn't want to be found, and was not assisting the rebellion. Is he supposed to be a cheery "aw shucks" lets take on the first order kind of character? Is that realistic to people?
Luke’s portrayal was congruent a how it left off in ROTJ. Pacifism and an unwilling to fight is what finally help his father help him/ see the light again. Striking down Kylo would have been contradicting that. That said - maybe he lost his way when in a moment of weakness he was about to strike down Ben. That may have reconfirmed his belief in pacifism. Idk ...
However if we’re picking knits i hated The shoulder brush off. Too pop culture-y for a story a long time ago in a galaxy far far away
Yeah. And the Hux prank call. But you know who probably likes them? Kids. Star Wars true and everlasting fan base.
Youre right that striking down Kylo wouldn't be true to his character but he didn't strike him down he just had a momentary lapse in judgement because he saw all of the potential pain he could cause. No one is 100% true to their character. People have lapses in judgement. Your ideal infallible Luke would never even think of doing some thing like that but realistic human Luke is dealing with that struggle like everyone else.
The change people want is simple. Instead of his redemption involving force projecting across the galaxy before dying, have his faith restored and rejoin the fight.
Having Luke die in TLJ after a 2 second cameo in TFA reeked of "Harrison Ford wanted to kill Han, so let's kill Luke too" while completely disregarding Mark Hamill's input and what he could still contribute to the franchise besides being a force ghost.